Nerf Tea by 50%

[Krotux]

Tea is objectively OP in classic. Originally, it was a one-time thing. Then it was possible to farm, and now it's freely accessible for around 40s.

It's stronger than healthstones AND also regen mana. Stronger than dark runes / demonic runes AND instead of costing health it also GIVES health.

Tea is objectively OP compared to all the similar non-potion consumables. Heck, even compared to potions it's way better than health and mana potions.

Even if you nerf tea by 50%, it would still be really good compared to other options. Regen 500-600 health AND mana would still be competitive. If people want maximum mana they should use runes, and if people want maximum health regen they should use healthstones.

One counterpoint is that hybrid classes are balanced around tea. That is not true, and even if it was, that should be addressed in the next class change update.

[Unsinn]

agree.

[Borefficz]

While I enjoy spamming tea it completely devalues demonic runes, and to an extent also healthstones. It is so strong it completely trivializes mana costs for hunters even in long fights.

[Calli]

It is not mandatory to use them. You would have been better asking for buff bosses.

[Jc473]

It is not mandatory to use them. You would have been better asking for buff bosses.

Buffing bosses would not achieve anything for this issue. In fact, if that's the only change they implemented, it would only increase the dependency/value of Nordanaar Tea.

Also, whether any consume is 'mandatory' or not, is besides the point. The fact is, for how easy it is acquire Nordanaar Tea, it simply is too powerful. Compare it to Dark/Demonic Runes (share same cooldown) which are infinitely more difficult to farm, aren't as powerful and have a negative side effect too. Furthermore, the salt into the wound is the fact that the Tea shares a cooldown with two class spells (Mage Mana Gem and Warlock Healthstone) and is more powerful than them. The saving grace is that it doesn't share a cooldown with potions otherwise, trust me, people would forgo using Major Mana Pots too.

The simplest solution is to either reduce the health/mana restored or give it a seperate cooldown which doesn't overlap with runes or healthstone/mana gem. However, if the latter option was done, this would further trivialise mana management in TWoW for raid encounters.

[Mackylol]

It is not mandatory to use them.

???

You would have been better asking for buff bosses.

So true, lets ask for something bigger. MORE effort, we dont want a minor change.. WE WANT BIG! BIG BOSSES, HARDER! MORE!

Or just change a consumable that is so clearly outshining every other resource consumable in the game. Its a 2-in-1 AND its cheap.

[Elisleris]

No. All are fine.

[Burunduk]

Farm of demonic runes was the worst thing in classic.
Turtle devs did the best change on this server, they added tea.

[Manletow]

These Tea are laughably overpowered (especially for hybrids)
I am a Shaman and abuse them in PVP -- its totally absurd

But like someone said -- its possible that hybrids get buffed in Class Changes 2.0 and then they will finally feel "safe" nerfing these OP consoooomables

[Burunduk]

Have you ever farmed runes on overpopulated server?
Do you know how hard it is?
You will waste all your free time fighting for mobs with the chinese.

Class changes will not give endless mana, and healers will have to use tons of runes and potions, but after tea nerf mana potions will cost like mongoose.
Imagine how many runes and potions you will need after new raids release?
I will leave server immidiatly after this change.

[Astrallizard]

This topic was already discussed in viewtopic.php?t=6517.

Also, check viewtopic.php?p=81092 and viewtopic.php?p=79754 which address this matter too.

[Krotux]

Have you ever farmed runes on overpopulated server?
Do you know how hard it is?
You will waste all your free time fighting for mobs with the chinese.

Class changes will not give endless mana, and healers will have to use tons of runes and potions, but after tea nerf mana potions will cost like mongoose.
Imagine how many runes and potions you will need after new raids release?
I will leave server immidiatly after this change.

Actually runes are extremely easy to get now. All the demons in hyjal drop runes, for example. I randomly have like 100+ demonic runes and not even trying.

[Ataika]

how its 40s ?
shard costs 1g

[Jstansberry]

Tea is very good, but why is it a problem?

[Elisleris]

It looks like this is a problem for those who like to complicate their lives and do not like QoL improvements

[Ataika]

It looks like the the is a problem for those who like to complicate their lives and do not like QoL improvements

Imagine calling QOL an item that makes class spells obsolete

[Xudo]

Tea is very good, but why is it a problem?

It is too good.

It is no-brainer button. All your way to 60 you need to manage mana: drink between pulls, get your mana potions prepared in case of emergency. When you start raiding you just hoard ton of tea and don't really care about mana.
There was Greater Dreamless Sleep Potion to restore mana. Huge restoration (compared to instant potion), but with drawback. Does anybody using it now?
There was Runes to restore mana. Good restoration with different cooldown at a cost of health. It is just crafting ingredient now.
In some other thread one raider said that he doesn't even consider Mageblood elixir (+12mp5) as useful one.
Do raiding warlocks use Life tap or they just drink tea too?

I mean, mana management was just removed from the game. It became like in TBC when healers had infinite mana.
I do understand that it allowed OOMkins, elemental shamans and shadow priests to do their DPS, but tea trivialized raiding for more mana-optimized classes.

[Krotux]

how its 40s ?
shard costs 1g

you get like 5 tea per shard (forgot the exact number atm)

[Foobs]

Farm of demonic runes was the worst thing in classic.
Turtle devs did the best change on this server, they added tea.

It looks like this is a problem for those who like to complicate their lives and do not like QoL improvements

+1

[Ataika]

how its 40s ?
shard costs 1g

you get like 5 tea per shard (forgot the exact number atm)

Damn its even cheaper then

[Akos1896]

Devs added an easy-to-get item which breaks the game.
Warlocks received a class quest in the past to create soulwell, which is a feels good spell, almost like an orange. Then tea came to the same GCD. Nowadays in raids I see warlock asking for cookie summoners out of pride and people are like lol man, we don't need that garbage (or people are just polite, summon the cookies, take them and never use them).
Tea gives HP and mana. The alternative for HP is obviously soulwell (just make it so that warlock's improved HS talent makes soulwell cookies better, too).
The alternative for mana would be the runes. If farming takes too much time, just increase tthe droprate.
Currently everyone can have almost infinite money with satyr shard farming anyway, and dark rune is a boe. You can buy as many as you want.
Tea in its current form really breaks the game. Me as a resto shammie started to not care about proper spell downgrades in fights. Mana tide totem also became a total joke (it kinda was in the past but still). Mana users can spend mana irresponsibly now in raids. Vanilla PVE is easy, one of the most important thing you had to manage as a caster was mana in longer fights. Not anymore.

[Krotux]

By the way, I didn't even say remove tea

I just said nerf it by 50% so that it is balanced. You can still use them. But if you want max mana regen you have to use runes instead. Runes cost hp so it is not always the best to use.

[Atreidon]

The "good classes" mostly can manage without tea. Warlocks & Mages do not need it to manage their mana even during challenging encounters. The ones that most benefit from tea are the classes that are paying the hybrid tax. Boomkins, offensive shamas prot pally etc are much more competetive due to habing tools to solve their mana issues.

Tea is incredibly strong, but so are runes, as the hp cost for the most part doesnt really matter. I do think tea could do with a nerf, but only if the manaproblems of the classes most affected get revisited.

Tea is a bandaid fix. It would be better to not have that manaproblem on some classes in the first place.but just demanding certain classes must waste a lot of time to farm their consumable is missguided imho.

There is certainly the case that tea makes the game much easier to heal and it does devalue beinging arcane mages & shadow priests for mana purposes quite a bit. Largely removing the upside of beinging those specs.

Changes to tea imho should happen. But just nerfing it and demanding people who play the weak classes go farm runes for hours is imho the wrong approach

[Ataika]

The "good classes" mostly can manage without tea. Warlocks & Mages do not need it to manage their mana even during challenging encounters. The ones that most benefit from tea are the classes that are paying the hybrid tax. Boomkins, offensive shamas prot pally etc are much more competetive due to habing tools to solve their mana issues.

Tea is incredibly strong, but so are runes, as the hp cost for the most part doesnt really matter. I do think tea could do with a nerf, but only if the manaproblems of the classes most affected get revisited.

Tea is a bandaid fix. It would be better to not have that manaproblem on some classes in the first place.but just demanding certain classes must waste a lot of time to farm their consumable is missguided imho.

There is certainly the case that tea makes the game much easier to heal and it does devalue beinging arcane mages & shadow priests for mana purposes quite a bit. Largely removing the upside of beinging those specs.

Changes to tea imho should happen. But just nerfing it and demanding people who play the weak classes go farm runes for hours is imho the wrong approach

simply remove the health part ?

[Krotux]

The "good classes" mostly can manage without tea. Warlocks & Mages do not need it to manage their mana even during challenging encounters. The ones that most benefit from tea are the classes that are paying the hybrid tax. Boomkins, offensive shamas prot pally etc are much more competetive due to habing tools to solve their mana issues.

Tea is incredibly strong, but so are runes, as the hp cost for the most part doesnt really matter. I do think tea could do with a nerf, but only if the manaproblems of the classes most affected get revisited.

Tea is a bandaid fix. It would be better to not have that manaproblem on some classes in the first place.but just demanding certain classes must waste a lot of time to farm their consumable is missguided imho.

There is certainly the case that tea makes the game much easier to heal and it does devalue beinging arcane mages & shadow priests for mana purposes quite a bit. Largely removing the upside of beinging those specs.

Changes to tea imho should happen. But just nerfing it and demanding people who play the weak classes go farm runes for hours is imho the wrong approach

Tea is a really recent addition, specially the easy to access Hyjal tea. Before that people did just fine and it wasn't a problem. If you think the issue is just that runes take time to get, just increase both demonic rune and the shadow rune drop rates significantly. Problem solved.

[Geojak]

tea is not a recent addition to twow. before hyjal you got your teas from the wintersrping quests. now its even easier to get the new hyjal tea. in the 2 years+ i have been on this server, tea has always been defining raiding

[Geojak]

from my old forum post that was linked above:
"we got
Whipper Root Tuber for health (~800 health)
Night Dragon's Breath (~420 Health & ~420 Mana)
Major Healthstone (1320 health)
Dark / Demonic Runes (- ~800 Health & ~1200 Mana)

Nerf tea to be only around 50% more powerfull than the night dragon from felwood to give other consumables reason to be situasionaly used like heslthsrones, mana ruby, demonic runes

New values
320 - 530 heal
640-1060 mana"

[Bahamutxd]

Although it may be a only mage thing, it renders mana stones useless aswell.

Doesn't seem to be right to me that an item like this makes core skills useless.

[Geojak]

Although it may be a only mage thing, it renders mana stones useless aswell.

Doesn't seem to be right to me that an item like this makes core skills useless.

agreed, it rly ruined the rpg immersion of wralocks health stone and mages mana gems when your special class skill is worse than some tea everyone uses

[Krotux]

I hope it is addressed in the next patch but would like to see devs say something

[Frantsel]

Remove it completely!

[Elleshar]

Also getting the rare MC recipe Major Rejuvenation Potion makes it totally worthless when it's much easier and cheaper to just farm shards for tea in Hyjal for the same effect.

[Astrallizard]

At this point I see no chance for a nerf. This consumable has been part of the TWoW gameplay for too long now, and farming it was even made easier with the Hyjal update.

[Krotux]

Also getting the rare MC recipe Major Rejuvenation Potion makes it totally worthless when it's much easier and cheaper to just farm shards for tea in Hyjal for the same effect.

ah yea totally forgot about this one.

Also to the guy above I disagree that it can't be nerfed because it's "been here too long". It's such a bullshit excuse.

[Sagabal]

I don't think this item should invalidate every single other item that shares its cooldown, is my biggest problem with it. If it was Unique (5) or something, or if it restored much lower numbers, or if it gave you a debuff that stopped you from using it for an hour... There's lots of ways to restrict the teas so that healthstone/managems/runes/felwood plants are at least sometimes relevant, instead of just being a waste of time.