Please redesign the Alliance Boat Routes

[Duvel]

Following patch 1.6, this is my understanding of the new Boat/Zeppellin routes to travel between 2 continents.



We can clearly see how much horde has a huge advantage. Orgrimar was already a inter-continent hub with 2 Zepellins, it is much more now with a 3rd Zeppelin and the new Gobelin port.

The alliance had only one boat hub and it was Menethil. Now it can't be considered as a hub anymore because you removed the boat from Menethil to Auberdine. New Stormwind's harbour is a complete joke in the actual state. It can't be considered as a hub either because it has only one liaison to Auberdine, which only deserves quickly the north of Kalimdor. The point of a hub is that you have MULTIPLE liaisons, just like the horde has. It is even more questionnable, considering that the Stormwind Harbour has 6 decks, and you only use one, and Auberdine has 3 decks and you only use 2.
So why have you removed the liaison from Auberdine to Menethil at all?
And why there isnt a liaison from Stormwind to Theramore??? I mean those are 2 important human cities, and its totally logical from the lore. Theramore do have empty decks you can use.

Now there's no reason anymore to have your Hearthstone in Ironforge. Unless you are a mage or an engineer, you have to heartsone Stormwind, which is what everybody will do. But then if you want to travel to Kalimndor center or South, you have to either :
* Fly BB and take boat to Ratchet
* Fly Menethil and take boat to Theramore.

Which is long and boring. I wouldn't mind if horde didn't had received 2 new very interesting routes added from Orgimmar, while alliance has nothing except a "switch" that is not interesting.

So the only way to try to balance this and makes Stormwind a real hub, would be this :


And that is basically 2 things:
1. Restore the boat Auberdine/Menethil
2. Add Stormwind/Theramore
The decks are there in the 4 harbors to do this.

And even in this new configuration, the horde would still be advantaged because Orgrimmar has 4 routes while stormwind only has 2.

Thank you

[Lahire]

Why was Menelith-Auberdine removed ? :o

[Duvel]

Why was Menelith-Auberdine removed ? :o

I dont know and I'd like to know.

With the removal of the Whormhole and this boat change, it has become a pain for alliance to travel to Kalimdor. This is clearly a downgrade from original Vanilla where you had Menethil at 2 minutes of IF to travel either North or South of Kalimdor. And I just can't be used to it.

I had highly expectations in Stormwind harbour because this was a clear missing component in original vanilla. But this is now a huge disappointment. This harbor has no purpose. It is long and boring to run there from SW bank,and it is just for one boat. The fact that there's no liaison to Theramore is absolutely not understandable to me, it was clearly the first thing to do.

If those boat routes were that much of a nightmare work like Torta said on Discord, the question is : why have you worked like this? Instead of removing one TOTALLY FINE existing liaison to replace it by an almost useless one, and working on a new unnecessary liaison for horde (to Hinterlands).... you could just have added the real liaison missing from a Geographical, faction balance, and LORE point of view : SW/Theramore !

This

With a heavy heart we have to announce that the Wormhole and Ardent Watch teleports have been discontinued. We believe that exploration and travelling is a crucial part of the game that shouldn't be undermined as often as we did in the past. See below to see additions we've made to compensate for the removal of these teleports:

is utterly true for horde, and totally false for alliance.
Hordes takes it all, and travels are now outrageously unbalanced.

[Duvel]

Just imagine: Alliance Raid to AQ.
Ok guys, take the fly to BB, wait the boat, take the boat to Ratchet, take the fly to Silithus. Ride down south.
You will arrive in 25 minutes, if you dont miss the boat.
No thanks.

[Kyzen]

I actually like Stormwind harbor and the new boat.

Maybe Turtle Wow should give Menethil harbor boat back, and add a new boat from stormwind harbor to Darnasus.
I find it convenient to go from Darkshore to Stormwind too.

[Reploidrocsa]

how about a SW -> Feathermoon stronghold boat?

[Kyzen]

how about a SW -> Feathermoon stronghold boat?

Not a bad idea

[Shatterfury]

how about a SW -> Feathermoon stronghold boat?

Auberdine - Feathermoon Stronghold :D

[Duvel]

For new destination you have to consider the available decks on the port. Its hard to add more boats to Feathermoon and RUtherean because they only have one deck. Although the utility of the Feathermoon boat has always been questionable

[Kyzen]

For new destination you have to consider the available decks on the port. Its hard to add more boats to Feathermoon and RUtherean because they only have one deck. Although the utility of the Feathermoon boat has always been questionable

Turtle WoW added decks and boat to new towns (sparkwater in Durotar for example), so I guess it's doable.

[Afaslizo]

Just imagine: Alliance Raid to AQ.
Ok guys, take the fly to BB, wait the boat, take the boat to Ratchet, take the fly to Silithus. Ride down south.
You will arrive in 25 minutes, if you dont miss the boat.
No thanks.

That is a good point. But Steamwheedle Port in Tanaris is missing a boat anyway so maybe it would be best to get a connection from Booty Bay to there anway OR add two ports to the southern half of Tanaris for both factions for easier access.

[Lahire]

SW - Menelith and SW - Theramore should both be a thingy.

[Duvel]

Just imagine: Alliance Raid to AQ.
Ok guys, take the fly to BB, wait the boat, take the boat to Ratchet, take the fly to Silithus. Ride down south.
You will arrive in 25 minutes, if you dont miss the boat.
No thanks.

That is a good point. But Steamwheedle Port in Tanaris is missing a boat anyway so maybe it would be best to get a connection from Booty Bay to there anway OR add two ports to the southern half of Tanaris for both factions for easier access.

So YET an additional boat for horde and still no real hub in SW. Yes that connection might be a ting. But the priority is Theramore/SW. We now have the biggest port in the world with enough decks for 10 connections, and there's only one boat there, the rest has no purpose at all apart decoration... while there are 3 Zepellins in Orgrimar, come on

ANother interesting human port to exploit is Soutshore

[Merikkinon]

OP's suggestion is superior to what the situation is now. I agree that Alliance has really been hurt with this My lower level toons (basically all) will be hurt because Menethil was a very good hub for them as they bopped back and forth between continents. Not so now.

Good for Horde, Alliance actually went backward, in a sense.

Suggest Menethil/Auberdine get reinstated.

Again, cannot understand any argument as to why it was removed.

[Zhohan]

I actually think the Wetlands run is a fundamental aspect to vanilla WoW.

[Duvel]

I actually think the Wetlands run is a fundamental aspect to vanilla WoW.

I had not even thought to this but I totally agree with you. That is a fundamental aspect of vanilla toon that is now broken.
The other is to hearthstone IF to have the real Menethil hub to travel Kalmindor. I still cant get used to this change after 2 days. I really miss my boat hub, that was fine. And I find the inter-continent travel really boring, while I liked it before.


Additionally I have noticed that this boat change bring a lot of inconsistencies:
* Panels on port decks indicate incorrect directions
* at leats one NPC still indicate incorect directions
* quests that lead you to travel from AUberdine and Menethil and vice-versa are no longer relevant

[Keek]

/push
Couldn't agree more. I think your suggestion seems fair.

[Arduron]

From an RP perspective the trip to Auberdine from SW would take forever and is such an odd choice if there is a shorter distance from Menethil. People would take the tram to IF and then a flight or tunnel to Dun Argath and if the path to menethil were clear, a trip down there.

A route to Theramore from Stormwind makes a lot more sense. Even if there's the Defias Quest chain regarding a certain missing diplomat, that one could be explained as using a less obvious route for the diplomat far from what they thought would be the reach of the Defias.

An additional Stormwind route could be to Caelan's Rest, though since the distance isn't terribly far it could work like the Feathermoon Ferry currently does. It would also give an opportunity to create an introductory chain for Caelan's Rest since as far as I'm aware there isn't one right now, we just kinda fly there.

Theramore also has three docks, and this one is mostly just a suggestion in regards to a story expansion as well. In WC3:TFT the first Night Elf mission has Maiev visit a Night Elf town on the sea that is admittedly getting wrecked by the Naga, but the ruins of that town aren't to be found in WoW. It could be another small questing hub to be added with the Night Elves trying to rebuild it? There could be a boat from Theramore to there, something that links the Night Elves to Theramore as you'd think would happen post-Hyjal. Some kind of cooperative effort to help each other out now that they're allies.

Another improvement could be a boat from Auberdine to Feathermoon Stronghold. Instead of that pointless ferry that loops around for ages, have the fisherman on the shore charter a rowboat that does an automated trip to the mainland with another fisherman on that side to do the reverse, for a small fee of course, say 50 silver? Most people opt to swim anyway, you could make it slightly faster than swimming. Then use the now free dock on Feathermoon to link up with Auberdine's empty dock.

This keeps the routes sensible and expands them to make the Alliance transports as versatile as the Horde's. Feathermoon is the Alliance's Kargath so it would be nice to also get there for at least the first time without trekking leagues down Kalimdor, like the Horde had to for Kargath.

A Neutral Port Expansion seems to be already in the works? At least from what I've seen. A boat has been added to the dock at Steamwheedle in Tanaris so maybe that is something for further mysteries yet to be discovered.

The Routes by Port
Auberdine: Menethil - Feathermoon - Darnassus
Menethil: Theramore - Auberdine
Stormwind: Theramore - Caelan's Rest
Theramore: Stormwind - Menethil - Azshara?

[Valadorn]

I was also considering making this post, the alliance has bigger harm then good with the current harbor, even if alliance has 2 boats in wetlands, and 2 boats in sw to the same destination. That will still be inferior to the fact that horde can go from anywhere to amywhere with the zeppelins.

[Joff]

I totally agree with this post ! Alliance need a SW > Theramore !

[Geojak]

Found it also hard to get used to the changes.
The triangle connection at menethil was rly useful to hop. It's a bit broken now.

I would like to see althese addtiions:
- menethil to southshore connection for sfk as alliance (this would work without teleport like darnanssus boat). Would be irrelevant after the fp is found thought
- sw to feralas for aq and diremul accessibility as alliance
- menethil to aubergine restore vanilla design were often quests deliberate have you use that triangle connection

And neutral steemwhedle port to booty Bay

And a flight point at the tirifsal uplands to reach scarlet monastery

[Andima]

i like

[Valadorn]

Alliance routes need to be reconsidered :(

[Hierobis]

Wouldn't it be possible to auto-connect the flight path from Rut'theran to Auberdine and remove the taxi to free up the docks at both ends for other routes? There's not much reason to ever use it after you have the flight connection.

Otherwise, I like the ideas proposed here.

[Reploidrocsa]

Wouldn't it be possible to auto-connect the flight path from Rut'theran to Auberdine and remove the taxi to free up the docks at both ends for other routes? There's not much reason to ever use it after you have the flight connection.

Otherwise, I like the ideas proposed here.

what about horde players going to teldrassil?

[Augustfenix85]

So basically. We want more boats. A boat for Steamwheedle to/from either Ratchet or Booty bay would be fantastic

[Garish]

i think that ally just need 1 boat SW-theramore and that is it. 1 neutral boat in durotar, 4 to horde and 3 to ally + 1 train.

[Philandros]

I agree with this second map, and the boat from Auberdine to Feathermoon (could even add it to the end of that 3 way dock), since their druids are leading that war.

[Hierobis]

what about horde players going to teldrassil?

As a casual player, I'm not sure how much transit should be designed around seemingly niche cross-faction use. Though I have no idea what the swim/water walk is like to get there.

[Markuis]

what about horde players going to teldrassil?

As a casual player, I'm not sure how much transit should be designed around seemingly niche cross-faction use. Though I have no idea what the swim/water walk is like to get there.

I think you can't access teldrassil swimming

[Geojak]

I used to have my hs on menethil harbor on leveling allaiance. Can each if fast, 2 boats.

Sw port mad allain e worse while horde gained 2 new addiotnsl routes.

We rly need justice

Pls

Even thought torta said no more boats because too much work :(

[Duvel]

After some months here, I noticed something really unpleasant on Turtle :
The staff carefully avoid to answer the LEGITIMATE players' demands.

Everyone is telling you that the new alliance boat routes are broken because you broke them, and you don't even react.
Are you all playing horde only?

Please address our demands and only I will become a donator.

[Kroppi]

Option 1

SW——> Darkshore
SW——> Theramore
SW——> Southershore

DS——> Stormwind
DS——> Teldrassil
DS——> Feathermoon Stronghold

Or

Option 2
MH——> Darkshore
MH——> Theramore


DS——> Menethil Harbor
DS——> Teldrassil
DS——> Feathermoon Stronghold

I prefer option 1 because Stormwind becomes the Hub. However out of both options it adds Feathermoon which I highly support. You only need to add a connection to southshore if you go with option 1. Otherwise since a lot of people seem to like option 2 do away with the Stormwind harbor.

Best wishes everyone

[Epicw]

If horde has a central zeppelin point Orgrimar, then, logicaly, alliance should have a central boat point at Stormwind with routes to Auderbine, Menethil and Theramore. Quests that directed you on routes that are no longer available and NPCs should be corrected (for example today I waited for a boat Menethil -> Auderbine because an NPC said that there is a boat that goes there )

Also on the idea on Steamweedle port in Tenaris, it would be awesome if there was a route Steam Weedle -> Booty Bay (as it is the biggest port is Steamweedle Cartel), but there is no extra docks. Unless our little Turtles will manage to fit one next to the bank for example

[Hir3]

My proposal:

ALLIANCE

Stormwind Connections(Boat)
-Auberdine
-Menethil
-Theramore

Ironforge Connections(Tram)
-Stormwind
-Gnomeregan: "Closed" tunnel with NPCs warning to go at your own risk. You run the length and can mount.
-Rut'Theran: Tram is a single small car that goes through a portal. Due to the energy required, it leaves only a third as often as the others to mimic the difficulty in the process. The original design was connecting Stormwind to Darnassus, which is why the Tram looks the way it does when you go on it.

Menethil Connections(Boat)
-Stormwind
-Theramore

Theramore Connections(Boat)
-Menethil
-Stormwind

Rut'Theran Connections(Boat)
-Auberdine

Auberdine Connections(Boat)
-Rut'Theran
-Stormwind
-Feathermoon Stronghold

Feathermoon Stronghold Connections(Boat)
-Auberdine

What this does: Makes inter-city travel really easy, with redundant routes for Role - Play. Gives easier Southern Kalimdor access for the Alliance without invalidating world travel. Think, all Alliance Kalimdor questers will already have nearly all FP's for Feralas access. Alliance will have reasonable travel to Southern Kalimdor from Eastern Kingdoms.

HORDE

Orgrimmar Connections(Zeppelin)
-Undercity
-Thunder Bluff
-Grom'Gol

Thunder Bluff Connections(Zeppelin)
-Orgrimmar

Grom'Gol Connections(Zeppelin)
-Orgimmar
-Badlands

Undercity Connections(Zeppelin)
-Orgrimmar

Revantusk Connections(Boat)
-Swamp of Sorrows

Swamp of Sorrows Connections(Boat)
-Revantusk

What this does: Reflects the Hordes more rocky, fragmented infrastructure. It makes more sense for Grom'gol, this major settlement somewhat equivalent to Theramore, as being the base of Southern EK travel, rather than Orgrimmar. Gives importance to the Horde outposts on the eastern edge of the EK, which currently make no logistical sense for the Horde to maintain.

Due to the nature of their societies, Alliance connections should be redundant and well-maintained. Horde connections should be, for gameplay purposes, somewhat balanced, but more sparse.