Shaman with different talent tree concept - creative corner only

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Akos1896
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Shaman with different talent tree concept - creative corner only

Post by Akos1896 » Sun Jun 16, 2024 4:20 pm

Hey!

The below article is not a suggestion, the purpose of this theorycrafting is fun only.
I do not believe that the structure I will work with could (or should) be implemented into TWOW.


As usual, the article will be long.

The idea is to create a new kind of talent tree and see how it would work out. Used shaman for my example because I am mostly familiar with them.
I apologize for my lack of Paint skills in advance. The tree would look like this:

Image

It would mean the following:
For the first three rows, the shaman has the classic options to choose talents from ele, enh or resto. However, rows 4-7 mean a certain specialization. You can only jump into any of the below specializations from row 3 of a related talent tree.
Let's say that you start taking talents in the enhancement tree. Rules are the usual, you can only start picking talents from the first row, later rows require a certain amount of learned talents in the tree. As you level up, you reach row 3 and you have the option to specialize. You either choose to be melee and go downwards, or you choose spellret and go into the enh+ele mixed specialization or you want to provide big utility and go into the enh+resto mixed specialization.
Specializations are mutually exclusive, having a talent in one means that no other specialization's talent can be learnt even if you are at row 3 of the related tree.
The base trees would give you the basics of the related spec. For example hit chance or added weapon damage at enh, cheaper healing spells at resto. Specializations would give the talents bigger bonuses, like a reworked bloodlust.

In this example I nerf shamans first so I can properly buff them based on the specialization they have.

The below totems or abilities would not be available at baseline:
* Chain heal
* Windfury Totem
* Shields, beside lightning shield
* Parry chance
* Two-handed weapons
* Poison and disease-cleansing totems
* Flametongue totem
* Earth shock

The base utility kit each shamans, regardless of their spec would have:
* Base poison and disease dispell
* Mana and life totems
* Tremor totem, threat reduction totem
* Strength totem, agility totem
* Wipe-protection
* Lesser healing wave, healing wave
* Kiting totem, damage reduction totem
* DoT shock, frost shock
* Elemental resistance
* Purge (however, would give it a CD).

These changes would make the base shaman quite weak. But the same allows for big an interesting buffs based on the talent tree.
After we stripped the shamans from 70% of their identity, it's time to give this identity back - to each build, a differently defined identity.

How the talent trees would look like?
The first three rows of a talent tree usually contain 25-30 spendable talent points.
A full talent tree usually has around 46.
Following this logic, each base tree will have 25-30 talent points and each specialization will have 16-21.

Let's start with ele!
Baseline ele talent tree will focus on casting radius, lightning bolt, chain lightning efficiency, spell interruption prevention, clearcasting, threat management, spell penetration and mana regeneration based on damage done. I will frequently use 'n' instead of a valid number to avoid balance fails. Of course no testing happened here, I can't tell what the exact numbers are for proper balance. I will also use 'tp' to state how many talent points you can spend in a talent. Effect will always be worded for a fully-learnt talent.

1st row
5tp - Increases your damage done via nature spells and shocks by n%.
3tp - Increases your spell hit chance by 3%.
2tp - If your HP goes below n% you get a focused casting effect, preventing you to lose casting time in the next 10 seconds. Can only activate once every minute.

2nd row
1tp - Landing a critical strike via a damaging spell gives you clearcasting state, which reduces the cost of your damaging spells by n% for n seconds.
2tp - Reduces the threat generated by your damaging nature spells by n% and increases their radius by n yards.
5tp - Each damaging spell gives you back n mana which is n% of the damage dealt by the spell.

3rd row
5tp - Reducing lightning bolt's and chain lightning's casting speed by 1 sec.
5tp - Increases the critical chance of your damaging spells by n%.

That's 28 talent points and cover the basics for elemental shaman (threat management, mana management, enabling good damage with nature spells + some spell penetration).

Next one is enh base tree.
They need added damage, weapon usage, parry, a melee CC and a way to run in and out of dangerous situations.

1st row
1tp - Enabling two-handed weapons.
5tp - Increases the damage done by your weapon by n%.
5tp - Enabling 5% parry chance and granting you an additional 5% melee crit chance.

2nd row
5tp - Granting 5 weapon skill to two-handed weapons and increasing melee haste by n% while using a two-hander.
3tp - Reduces the casting time of your ghost wolf by 100%.
1tp - Gives the shaman a whirlwind-based CC, the one which certain centaurs have in the game.

3rd row
5tp - Increases attack speed by 30% for the next 3 melee swings after a melee crit. Added crit talent is needed for it.
3tp - Each melee crit recharges n% of your total mana.

Those would be the 28 talent points for basic enh. Compared to the current iteration, I took away the totem utility, improved weapon enhancement, bloodlust and the tanking talents and gave them some melee haste, a CC and a way to manage mana other than the water shield which they have lost in this theorycrafting.

Next one is restoration.
Without chain heal, they are mostly single-target healers. Will improve upon the (lesser) healing waves, will improve their wipe-prevention, will make healing totem better and will give them cleansing totems.

1st row
5tp - Healing wave casting time gets reduced by 0,5 seconds.
5tp - Reduces the mana cost of healing spells by 5%.

2nd row
2tp - Reduces reincarnation CD by 20 minutes and gives +20% health and mana upon reincarnating.
3tp - Increases the target's stats by n% for n seconds after a healing crit.
5 tp - Increases healing spell crit chance by 5%.

3rd row
3tp - Reduces threat made by healing spells by 15%.
2tp - 70% to prevent spell interruption while casting a healing spell.
1tp - Replaces healing stream and mana spring totem to rejuvenation totem which allows your party members 10% of full spirit health and mana regeneration to continue in combat. Stacks with similar effects but not with other rejuvenation totems.
1tp - Gives the shaman a cleansing totem which dispells both poison and disease.
1tp - Gives the shaman water shield which gives them mana when is being procced and as a passive, gives them 5% full spirit mana regeneration while the shield is on.

These are the 28 talent points for resto. One specialization will go into big heals, including chain heal, the other one will further improve upon totems and will bring great party utility.

The specializations
Each one of these will contains 18 talents.

Pure ele

The goal of this specialization to make ele a more potent and more interesting caster.

4th row
1tp - Increases the radius of flame shock, making it equal to lightning bolt and chain lightning.
3tp - Each damaging nature spell has a n% chance to apply flame shock on the target(s).
5tp - Reduces the CD of chain lightning by n seconds.

5th row
1tp - Increases the damage bonus of your spell crits by 100%.
3tp - Flame shocks decreases the target's resistence against nature spells by n%.
1tp - Teaches the shaman hex. Hex would work like polymorph except that the target can freely move in frog form.

6th row
1tp - Gives the elemental shaman a 3 min CD ability which increases his spell crit chance by n% for 10 seconds.
1tp - Flame shock ticks have a 10% chance to crit.

7th row
1tp - Gives the elemental shaman a summonable fire elemental pet (imp-like damage) which applies flame shock on the target if crits.
1tp - Gives the elemental shaman a fire totem which increases the party's spell damage.

How pure ele would play?
It would be a caster with sustained threat- and mana management. Would cast flame shock on the main target at max range and would summon his fire elemental for DPS and for putting up flame shocks. Has a very big burst window with added crit chance and also has spell damage party-utility. In exchange his melee-utility is much weaker (no more WF totem), his cleansing is slow, he cannot interrupt or instant cast with Nature's Swiftness and his off-heals are worse.

Spellhance
This is the flametongue build which also revolves around shocks. Mostly geared towards + spell damage, the goal of this build is to deal big spell damage while also doing melee.

4th row
1tp - Gives the shaman flametongue totem. Flametongue totem bonus equals to the current improved flamtongue totem (improved weapon totems fully learned). Damaging fire totems' damage also scales with n% of your spell power.
1tp - Gives the shaman earth shock (Cata version). It doesn't have extra threat and earth shock debuffs the target's melee haste by n% for n seconds.
5tp - Increases the damage (n%) and the crit chance (5%) of your shock spells.

5th row
3tp - Offensive spell crits increases melee crit chance by 9% for 10 seconds.
3tp - Reduces the CD of your shock spells by 1 second.
1tp - Gives the shaman an improved version of lightning shield. It's procs somewhat scale with your spell damage and while it is on, the lightning shield gives the shaman 2% spell crit chance.
1tp - Frost shocks also interrupt the target (but they don't lock him out of any spell school).

6th row
1tp - As long as you use flametongue weapon, your spell hit chance is increased by 3%. If you use frostbrand weapon, your spell crit is increased by 3%. If you use windfury weapon, your melee crit is increased by 3% if you use rockbiter weapon, and your melee hit is increased. Rockbiter weapon also loses the extra threat.

7th row
1tp - You can use 2 weapon enhancements simultaneously. You can also use the same enhancement twice (giving yourself 6% spell crit chance for example).
1tp - Each melee crit reduces the CD on your shocks by 2 seconds.

You can build up this specialization two ways. Those, who enter spellhance mostly from ele have better spells, including shock crit chance and shock damage. Those who mostly have enh talents have a better melee background, bigger melee haste and crit chance. This would be the only shaman spec which has access to an interrupt.

Pure enh
This build will enable a melee DPS which, while sometimes uses damaging spells, focuses mostly on physical damage.

4th row
1tp - Merges rockbiter weapon and windfury weapon into one weapon enhancement. It has no added threat, otherwise it retains the effects of both enhancements.
1tp - Stormstrike - Gives the shaman a 10 second CD ability which changes his next melee hit into a double-strike. It also increases the shaman's agility by 10% for 5 seconds (no nature spell debuff on the target).
5tp - Each melee crit increases your attack power by n% for 10 seconds. Stackable 3 times.
2tp - Each of your melee attacks has a 10% chance to become a cleave and damage an additional nearby enemy.

5th row
5tp - Shaman totems which give stat bonus give you 25% more stat bonus.
1tp - Purge loses its CD.

6th row
1tp - Gives the shaman earth shield which reduces incoming damage every time it procs and as a passive effect reduces the threat of the shaman's melee attacks by 10% while it is on the shaman.

7th row
1tp - Gives the shaman bloodlust. It is a 5 minute CD ability which increases the party members' melee haste by 20% for 10 seconds.
1tp - Gives the shaman spirit wolves, which can be summoned for 20 seconds on a n min CD. Enemies attacked by the spirit wolves receive n% more damage from the shaman as long as the wolves are actively attacking the target.

The pure enh specialization is mainly focused on dealing as much damage as possible. It still has some totem utility but while he can get windfury procs, he can't provide the same to his teammates. Even his utility is a bit selfish. Each totem he places for a buff will buff him more than the others. In exchange, bloodlust affects all melees in the party but it only lasts for 10 seconds.
Also, only the pure-melee build will be able to spam purge. I don'th think it is healthy if the current purge is baseline or if (specifically) elemental shamans (and to a lesser degree, restos) can spam it.

The utility build aka. the totem twisters

This build plays differently based on the basic talent tree you've taken the most points from. If you mostly went into resto, they will be similar to the current 'bloodlust restos'. Instead of chain heals they'd need to cast healing waves and lesser healing waves, though. In exchange, they have an even bigger impact on group utility (despite not having bloodlust). Those, who come from the enh tree are melee players with low damage, who do some auto hits and shocks between the twists.
The build is based around making your totems better and giving you talents which reward the totem-twisting gameplay. They are utility first and healers or DPS second.

4th row
1tp - Your totems which give stat buff, mana/heath regeneration, elemental resistance or damage reduction will affect the party up to 10 seconds after the totem has been revoked (kinda how windfury is working now). Only up to two effects from the same totem element can be active by one shaman at the same time (you cannot twist 3 or more totem effects from the same element).
2tp - Increases the stat boost that strength and agility totems give by 20%.
3tp - Changes stoneskin and windwall totems into an upgraded version of them which reduces the melee (stoneskin) or ranged and casted (windwall) damage your party receive by 15%.
2tp - Tremor totem shakes the ground every 3 seconds, not 5 and tranquil air totem gets +10% threat reduction.

5th row
3tp - Decreases the cost of your totems by 30% and increases the mana refund of totemic recall by 20%.
3tp - The radius of the friendly totems' effect is increased by 15 yards.
1tp - Increases the health and mana regeneration bonus of rejuvenation totem by 5%.

6th row
1tp - Your cleansing totem also cleanses curses.

7th row
1tp - If you summoned two totems from the same element within 2 seconds, the second one does not cost any mana.
1tp - Gives the shaman windfury totem (works the same way as improved WF via the talent improved weapon totems).

This will be the only shaman specialization with a bigger totem radius. The others have to stay close to the party members (for example an elemental shaman won't be able to effectively give totem support to the melee in raid).
The gameplay of this build is similar to a drummer. You start the fight, set up your totems and twist. In the downtime you heal 1-2x or hit the enemy 1-2x (maybe with a Nightfall). This build is the closest to the pure support concept.

The pure healer
This build is focused on wide raid-healing. With the tools of improved chain heal, healing way and riptide, the pure resto shaman will heal wave-like - they are capable of huge burst heals for a limited amount of time but those bursts have to be set up. They provide less support than the current resto shamans but they have a more varied healing.

4th row
3tp - Healing waves, chain heals (main target) and lesser healing waves give a 6% healing buff from the shaman on the target for 15 seconds. Stacks up to 3 times.
1tp - Teaches the shaman chain heal. Chain heal will be the same as the ability after having the 3-set tier bonus of T2 (meaning +30% healing on the 2nd and the 3rd target).
5tp - Increases your healing done by 10%.

5th row
1tp - Teaches the shaman riptide. Riptide is an instant cast, 6 sec CD spell which gives a small base healing and a HoT onto the target. The next chain heal on the target with riptide HoT gets +25% bigger but the HoT gets removed.
1tp - Teaches the shaman Nature's Swiftness which is a 3 minute CD ability. It makes the next nature spell instant-cast.
3tp - Decreases the CD of riptide by 3 seconds.
1tp - Chain heal crits jump to four targets. The fourth target receives equal amount of healing as the third target.

6th row
1tp - A chain heal crit reduces the casting time of your next healing wave (to 1 sec) or lesser healing wave (to 0,5 sec).

7th row
1tp - When you drop below 30% mana, your healing spells get 50% cheaper for 10 seconds. Can only happen once in a minute.
1tp - Healing wave and lesser healing wave have a 20% chance to apply riptide on the target.

For a pure resto shaman, the name of the game is timing. They are capable of huge bursts of healing as long as healing way is up, primordial waves are up and the shaman's crit chance is high enough. Optimal build for wide-healing and for 'focused wide-healing', setting up riptides on the tank and then healing the nearby melees automatically via chain heals.

Image
Last edited by Akos1896 on Tue Jun 18, 2024 10:31 am, edited 2 times in total.

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Manletow
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Re: Shaman with different talent tree concept - creative corner only

Post by Manletow » Mon Jun 17, 2024 1:28 pm

The appeal/charm of Talent Trees is their relative simplicity.
This is needlessly complex and convoluted.
And despite adding two "new" tree branches you somehow managed to create less options for the class
(via removal of Tanking talents)

Terrible game design -- but its cool -- I'm glad you are having fun bud.
No worries!
Paladin is broken in PVP.
Frost Mage is broken in PVP/PVE.
Warrior is awful in PVP.
Feral Druid is mediocre in PVP.
Enhancement Shaman is fine. Stop begging for goofy custom abilities.

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