About Tel'abim PvP situation, DISABLE /WHO function

[Neltharion]

So, I'm writing this complain due to the situation Horde has at the moment regarding World PvP when it comes to fighting World Bosses: I want to be clear that I know for sure that 75% of the fault is ours, Horde is not as near organised as our Ally fellas are.
But this is not due to our incompetence only (mostly yes) but also due to something that doesn't really work on a PvP server, being that the /who function.

One of the reasons why Allies have advantage over us is that they are WAY more tryharders than us, creating horde toons to spam /who and spy our world chat constantly.
We had the proof today when we moved to kill Ysondre in Ashenvale and Alliance knew exactly what we were doing right away.

First thing, being able to create two characters on the same account is kind of dumb, but I understand people could just create multiple accounts and make toons of the opposing faction to spy, even if that was disabled.
So the only solution that comes to mind is to disable the /who function, because it literally kills the PvP experience.
It's not simply fun to play against frenzied tryharders who create multiple horde toons just to spam /who: TWoW should have that pure and immersive feeling, even when it regards PvP.
Also I think the position of your Friends List should NOT be displayed, otherwise people could just add to the friends list people that they want to spy.

In Classic you couldn't create two characters of two different factions in the same account and that was perfect, because the game was not free to play and if you wanted to have two accounts, well, you had to pay.
But here, being this a private server, is not possible.
So please, give a wave of fresh air to Tel'abim PvP, removing the possibility to these tryharders to ruin a whole faction experience, by removing the /who function and not displaying position in the Friends List.

Thanks, hoping to hear from TWoW devs soon.

[Mackylol]

Ouff.. /who is super useful for making groups.. hard disagree.

You admit that the fault is mostly on your faction so we need to break the game to remedy that?

[Neltharion]

Sorry but we have world chat and LFT for groups
Never in all the years I played wow i used /who to look for groups
By the way yes, it is our fault, but even if both were good, the toxicity of tryharders remains
I don't think being a tryharder ourselves solves the problem
This is not what twow is about.

[Darktifa]

Even if they disable creating toons in different factions
you can always create a 2nd account

Even if they disable /who
they can add you as a friend

[Manowar76]

I guess they coulddd just remove /who and friend's list showing people's location. I think you only need to know someone's level and class to be able to form groups with it anyways.

[Mackylol]

Sorry but we have world chat and LFT for groups
Never in all the years I played wow i used /who to look for groups
By the way yes, it is our fault, but even if both were good, the toxicity of tryharders remains
I don't think being a tryharder ourselves solves the problem
This is not what twow is about.

Completely non-sensical post. What about TWoW makes you feel entitled to these bosses over people who play the game more religiously than you do?

If for some reason one day, you dont want to sit in LFT for an hour waiting for someone to trickle into the queue heres a great tip:
/who c-hunter 60

This will show you all 60 hunters that are online at the moment, copy paste a message to the ones that are not already busy doing something. You can make a group for most things in 5 minutes this way.

I see that you really really want loot from these bosses since you are posting here but you don't "need" these bosses and you are most definately not entitled to them, even less so by breaking game functions that most likely wouldnt help you regardless.

Step 1. Learn the tactics.
Step 2. Get a raid leader that can actually control you mongrels.
Step 3. Get like-minded people into the raid.

If you want the carebear version of the game, play on Nordanaar.

[Neltharion]

Sorry but we have world chat and LFT for groups
Never in all the years I played wow i used /who to look for groups
By the way yes, it is our fault, but even if both were good, the toxicity of tryharders remains
I don't think being a tryharder ourselves solves the problem
This is not what twow is about.

Completely non-sensical post. What about TWoW makes you feel entitled to these bosses over people who play the game more religiously than you do?

If for some reason one day, you dont want to sit in LFT for an hour waiting for someone to trickle into the queue heres a great tip:
/who c-hunter 60

This will show you all 60 hunters that are online at the moment, copy paste a message to the ones that are not already busy doing something. You can make a group for most things in 5 minutes this way.

I see that you really really want loot from these bosses since you are posting here but you don't "need" these bosses and you are most definately not entitled to them, even less so by breaking game functions that most likely wouldnt help you regardless.

Step 1. Learn the tactics.
Step 2. Get a raid leader that can actually control you mongrels.
Step 3. Get like-minded people into the raid.

If you want the carebear version of the game, play on Nordanaar.

It's nonsensical for you because you don't care about it.
The /who function can be useful, yes, but it brings toxicity
And it's not about loot, it's about having to worry about alliance tryharders who abuse the /who function to prevent you from doing things
I can assure you'll find groups without /who
Ascension wow had that function disabled and it worked great.

[Mackylol]

Sorry but we have world chat and LFT for groups
Never in all the years I played wow i used /who to look for groups
By the way yes, it is our fault, but even if both were good, the toxicity of tryharders remains
I don't think being a tryharder ourselves solves the problem
This is not what twow is about.

Completely non-sensical post. What about TWoW makes you feel entitled to these bosses over people who play the game more religiously than you do?

If for some reason one day, you dont want to sit in LFT for an hour waiting for someone to trickle into the queue heres a great tip:
/who c-hunter 60

This will show you all 60 hunters that are online at the moment, copy paste a message to the ones that are not already busy doing something. You can make a group for most things in 5 minutes this way.

I see that you really really want loot from these bosses since you are posting here but you don't "need" these bosses and you are most definately not entitled to them, even less so by breaking game functions that most likely wouldnt help you regardless.

Step 1. Learn the tactics.
Step 2. Get a raid leader that can actually control you mongrels.
Step 3. Get like-minded people into the raid.

If you want the carebear version of the game, play on Nordanaar.

It's nonsensical for you because you don't care about it.
The /who function can be useful, yes, but it brings toxicity
And it's not about loot, it's about having to worry about alliance tryharders who abuse the /who function to prevent you from doing things
I can assure you'll find groups without /who
Ascension wow had that function disabled and it worked great.

You just haven't thought this idea through in the slightest, your post is toxic. Just submit to the greater faction, the bosses belong to us -- you are on my friends list anyways Dragonwhaaawhaababy.

[Ishilu]

If for some reason one day, you dont want to sit in LFT for an hour waiting for someone to trickle into the queue heres a great tip:
/who c-hunter 60

This will show you all 60 hunters that are online at the moment, copy paste a message to the ones that are not already busy doing something. You can make a group for most things in 5 minutes this way.

This. /who makes finding groups faster and easier and I often get better groups with less drama or loot competition simply by handpicking people and not drawing a lottery ticket from the LFT tool.

I do agree that cheating via /who should be made harder and bannable.
Part of the ideal solution would be:
1. Only characters of a single faction on each account on Tel Abim.
2. Some technical hurdles for multiboxing (is that even allowed on Tel Abim?!) and/or fast logging between accounts belonging to different factions.

A limitation of /who might also do the trick. Let's say people need to be lvl 40+ in order to see lvl 60 players in /who. Cheaters would have to sink many hours into leveling if they want to abuse the function while people looking for a low level dungeon group wouldn't be affected.

[Mackylol]

If for some reason one day, you dont want to sit in LFT for an hour waiting for someone to trickle into the queue heres a great tip:
/who c-hunter 60

This will show you all 60 hunters that are online at the moment, copy paste a message to the ones that are not already busy doing something. You can make a group for most things in 5 minutes this way.

This. /who makes finding groups faster and easier and I often get better groups with less drama or loot competition simply by handpicking people and not drawing a lottery ticket from the LFT tool.

I do agree that cheating via /who should be made harder and bannable.
Part of the ideal solution would be:
1. Only characters of a single faction on each account on Tel Abim.
2. Some technical hurdles for multiboxing (is that even allowed on Tel Abim?!) and/or fast logging between accounts belonging to different factions.

A limitation of /who might also do the trick. Let's say people need to be lvl 40+ in order to see lvl 60 players in /who. Cheaters would have to sink many hours into leveling if they want to abuse the function while people looking for a low level dungeon group wouldn't be affected.

+1

[Xudo]

This. /who makes finding groups faster and easier and I often get better groups with less drama or loot competition simply by handpicking people and not drawing a lottery ticket from the LFT tool.

I do agree that cheating via /who should be made harder and bannable.
Part of the ideal solution would be:
1. Only characters of a single faction on each account on Tel Abim.
2. Some technical hurdles for multiboxing (is that even allowed on Tel Abim?!) and/or fast logging between accounts belonging to different factions.

A limitation of /who might also do the trick. Let's say people need to be lvl 40+ in order to see lvl 60 players in /who. Cheaters would have to sink many hours into leveling if they want to abuse the function while people looking for a low level dungeon group wouldn't be affected.

QFT. I completely agree.

[Neltharion]

Completely non-sensical post. What about TWoW makes you feel entitled to these bosses over people who play the game more religiously than you do?

If for some reason one day, you dont want to sit in LFT for an hour waiting for someone to trickle into the queue heres a great tip:
/who c-hunter 60

This will show you all 60 hunters that are online at the moment, copy paste a message to the ones that are not already busy doing something. You can make a group for most things in 5 minutes this way.

I see that you really really want loot from these bosses since you are posting here but you don't "need" these bosses and you are most definately not entitled to them, even less so by breaking game functions that most likely wouldnt help you regardless.

Step 1. Learn the tactics.
Step 2. Get a raid leader that can actually control you mongrels.
Step 3. Get like-minded people into the raid.

If you want the carebear version of the game, play on Nordanaar.

It's nonsensical for you because you don't care about it.
The /who function can be useful, yes, but it brings toxicity
And it's not about loot, it's about having to worry about alliance tryharders who abuse the /who function to prevent you from doing things
I can assure you'll find groups without /who
Ascension wow had that function disabled and it worked great.

You just haven't thought this idea through in the slightest, your post is toxic. Just submit to the greater faction, the bosses belong to us -- you are on my friends list anyways Dragonwhaaawhaababy.

Brother look how you answered me, that's pretty much self explanatory to who's being toxic here xD

[Neltharion]

If for some reason one day, you dont want to sit in LFT for an hour waiting for someone to trickle into the queue heres a great tip:
/who c-hunter 60

This will show you all 60 hunters that are online at the moment, copy paste a message to the ones that are not already busy doing something. You can make a group for most things in 5 minutes this way.

This. /who makes finding groups faster and easier and I often get better groups with less drama or loot competition simply by handpicking people and not drawing a lottery ticket from the LFT tool.

I do agree that cheating via /who should be made harder and bannable.
Part of the ideal solution would be:
1. Only characters of a single faction on each account on Tel Abim.
2. Some technical hurdles for multiboxing (is that even allowed on Tel Abim?!) and/or fast logging between accounts belonging to different factions.

A limitation of /who might also do the trick. Let's say people need to be lvl 40+ in order to see lvl 60 players in /who. Cheaters would have to sink many hours into leveling if they want to abuse the function while people looking for a low level dungeon group wouldn't be affected.

+1 tbh
Great suggestions

[Zvyrhol]

I do agree that cheating via /who should be made harder and bannable.

Bannable? Did you even wonder how GMs are going to execute bans for abusing /who during world boss fights if this become illegal? Everyone who typed /who on chat during the fight will be banned? And how GMs are going to judge whether or not one team used /who for an advantage? Maybe they play better, I have no idea.

1. Only characters of a single faction on each account on Tel Abim.

As Darktifa said, you can create new account very easily, in 5 minutes, then use /who to your advantage. Anyway it's too late to implement this change now, some players already have characters in both factions.

A limitation of /who might also do the trick. Let's say people need to be lvl 40+ in order to see lvl 60 players in /who. Cheaters would have to sink many hours into leveling if they want to abuse the function while people looking for a low level dungeon group wouldn't be affected.

This doesn't solve problem at all in long-term because we are talking about world boss content which is even more elitist than raiding one. Even if /who function becomes accessible to only level 60 characters, do you think that nobody from one faction wouldn't be able to level up a character just for world boss scouting purpose? For some sweatlords it could take one week to achieve this especially which +50% xp bonus + tents.

[Koronisz]

The sole reason you are losing world boss fights is due to your inability to organize effectively.

[Ishilu]

I do agree that cheating via /who should be made harder and bannable.

Bannable? Did you even wonder how GMs are going to execute bans for abusing /who during world boss fights if this become illegal? Everyone who typed /who on chat during the fight will be banned? And how GMs are going to judge whether or not one team used /who for an advantage? Maybe they play better, I have no idea.

1. Only characters of a single faction on each account on Tel Abim.

As Darktifa said, you can create new account very easily, in 5 minutes, then use /who to your advantage. Anyway it's too late to implement this change now, some players already have characters in both factions.

A limitation of /who might also do the trick. Let's say people need to be lvl 40+ in order to see lvl 60 players in /who. Cheaters would have to sink many hours into leveling if they want to abuse the function while people looking for a low level dungeon group wouldn't be affected.

This doesn't solve problem at all in long-term because we are talking about world boss content which is even more elitist than raiding one. Even if /who function becomes accessible to only level 60 characters, do you think that nobody from one faction wouldn't be able to level up a character just for world boss scouting purpose? For some sweatlords it could take one week to achieve this especially which +50% xp bonus + tents.

You're right, my suggestions are far from perfect. Keep in mind that whatever we or the team think of, there will always be loopholes and somebody on the internet will make the effort to expoit these. Some problems can't be solved but at least we can try to minimize them. Turtle is not the only vanilla server so we might be lucky and some cheaters are deterred by the effort and move on.

About your other concerns:
1) Assuming they would really implement this 1-faction-per-account thing: How about giving people an opportunity to swap races or compensate them in another way? Another option would be a (bad word incoming) fresh start with an updated ruleset. That would be drastic and annoy some people but might help in the long run. Not for us to decide, but we should consider that different servers require different rulesets.

2) I believe that the idea of multiple accounts can be overcome. I've played on that TBC server where they monitored which account logged in from which IP address. I'm not an expert on this stuff but I remember being asked a few harsh questions by their team after visiting a friend and playing from there.

3) Making /who abuse bannable under current conditions is very close to impossible. Good point.

Final note: What's stopping people from parking rouge and druid alts of their own faction in strategic locations? Maybe we worry too much about this.

[Zokk]

Honestly, don't worry about it. I actually pity most of the Alli neckbeard basement dwellers.
Some of these boys currently r13 cant have any kind life, must have terrible mental health.being online that much and living in BGs simply isnt good for you.

[Toaomb]

Hey just weighing in.

I understand it's frustrating that Alliance players might spy and then find you to kill your world bosses.

I have to mention that many players are focused on doing quests and other things and might not queue in LFT or pay attention to world chat. I happen to use /who list every single day to get tanks and healers for dungeons, even while using LFT and world chat to try to get groups going.

There is just a higher chance of getting a group together when you whisper someone personally, rather than hoping they're paying attention or happen to want to queue for the same dungeons as you at the same time.

I get it, spies and people killing your world bosses is super lame, but I don't think disabling the ability to look for people in your level bracket is the answer.

I think a better solution might be turning that world boss into a massive Call to Arms situation and using the available channels to call out to other players and turn it into a massive multi-raid battle, even if only 1 raid group is getting the loot. Is a PvP server after all.

[Ataika]

Imagine losing world bosses as a pvp faction.

horde kids be like
> we are mighty pvp faction we play to kill alliance lok tar ogar kor kron uh oh
> whaa whaa why alliance pegged us and stole our boss whaaa

[Neltharion]

Imagine losing world bosses as a pvp faction.

horde kids be like
> we are mighty pvp faction we play to kill alliance lok tar ogar
> whaa whaa why alliance pegged us and stole our boss whaaa

Smartest alliance player right there

[Ataika]

Imagine losing world bosses as a pvp faction.

horde kids be like
> we are mighty pvp faction we play to kill alliance lok tar ogar
> whaa whaa why alliance pegged us and stole our boss whaaa

Smartest alliance player right there

Weakest horde player right there

[Charanko]

Horde does the same from what i know

[Neltharion]

Horde does the same from what i know

Yes, but it's still wrong
Doesn't matter who does it

I've thought about some solutions and just being able to choose to show your location or not in /who or FL would be a nice option

I understand that deleting the whole /who function may be too drastic

[Majestik51]

bro dont be like them pls.
we just had no organisation for this.
also for some spots that we hid, maybe was my mistake cause i was live streaming with no delay.

so pls get over it, and move on....

[Akos1896]

I partially agree with the OP (never played PVP though).
If you can abuse the system to get unfair advantage, the advice to abuse the system the same way for balance is bad, in my opinion.
Not showing location data even as friends seems to be a good idea. Just saying that bro, cheat the same way implies that the system is inherently flawed.

[Ataika]

Horde does the same from what i know

Yes, but it's still wrong
Doesn't matter who does it

I've thought about some solutions and just being able to choose to show your location or not in /who or FL would be a nice option

I understand that deleting the whole /who function may be too drastic

You lose because you suck in pvp, not because some1 has a /who option.
I had a laugh when i read this post, let me summarise.
You came to the pvp server to have pvp and now butthurting because alliance pegs you at world boss and does not allow to freely kill it. Do i understand everything correctly ?
Move to pve server and disable pvp, u wont have problems here if you want to hug a mob without beign disturbed by other players.

Sick hint - even if developers will follow your pansy suggestions and disable .who (LOL), there will be a "low lvl parked alt with /t spam" that still counters you hard. Just get good and stop crying over pvp.

[Darktifa]

maybe was my mistake cause i was live streaming with no delay.

[Majestik51]

maybe was my mistake cause i was live streaming with no delay.

ela filos ti ginete?

[Neltharion]

Horde does the same from what i know

Yes, but it's still wrong
Doesn't matter who does it

I've thought about some solutions and just being able to choose to show your location or not in /who or FL would be a nice option

I understand that deleting the whole /who function may be too drastic

You lose because you suck in pvp, not because some1 has a /who option.
I had a laugh when i read this post, let me summarise.
You came to the pvp server to have pvp and now butthurting because alliance pegs you at world boss and does not allow to freely kill it. Do i understand everything correctly ?
Move to pve server and disable pvp, u wont have problems here if you want to hug a mob without beign disturbed by other players.

Sick hint - even if developers will follow your pansy suggestions and disable .who (LOL), there will be a "low lvl parked alt with /t spam" that still counters you hard. Just get good and stop crying over pvp.

Sweet, this is the perfect answer you could give me to prove my point

We have actually two cases scenario here:
1. You're dumb and lack of English written comprehension but I highly doubt this is the case
2. You're exactly part of the problem I explained above, which I am 99% convinced this is the case

What we're dealing is absolute free toxicity which is why having the possibility to create characters of the opposing faction AND an easy access to what the other faction is doing/saying or even where they are, due to the easy access to the /who tool, which is not wrong by itself, is wrong.
I don't care who does it, horde or alliance, it just shouldn't be possible to do such things
You said it, this is a PvP server, it simply don't work, unless you're a neckbearded no life tryharder, that you probably are.
If not, why would you even care to have the /who tool limited? How would it affect you if I wanted my position to not be displayed to clearly level 1 alliance characters that actively spy on my position?
This does not regard world bosses only, and you probably know that, seeing how toxic you're being

Making the /who tool limited does not affect anyone, other than the kind of people like you

Just a couple of hours ago I've seen two level 1 orcs parked in Ratchet, and one of them even called "Notspy" lol
I wouldn't even surprised if it was yours.

PS: if you are who I think you are I probably lost the count of how many times i killed you in bgs, so yeah, don't act like the cool guy who's good at pvp, come on :)

[Reignwizard]

this is normal things to do.

I remember back in 2008, we also do this in our internet cafe. we track their big man to know where they went.

good luck I hope you can steal WB from alliance.

[Hyrag]

get gud

[Voulome]

I think a better solution might be turning that world boss into a massive Call to Arms situation and using the available channels to call out to other players and turn it into a massive multi-raid battle, even if only 1 raid group is getting the loot. Is a PvP server after all.

Here's a very good idea to prevent all the /who spying or lvl 1 at blasted land toon shenanigan.
When a worldboss spawn, there should be a server message or a massive /shout from him on the whole two continent so everyone curently connected know it instantly.

This raid vs raid kazzak "server restart in 15 minutes" battle was so good i wish all worldboss would be like that xD

and if it happen at 4 am well, that's life !

[Sagabal]

Holy shit, a continent wide "Lord Kazzak returns to this plane in 1 hour! Prepare yourselves!" would be so insane for wpvp.

[Voulome]

imagine the mayhem it would cause xD

[Ibux]

the town guards could yell in the big towns when world bosses spawn "scouts have discovered x world boss in x location. strong adventurers report to x npc for a quest to slay them for big ass gold reward". it would maybe make camping the bosses less useful also if you would need to go back to town to get the kill quest for the big reward.