High elf warlocks

[Diademuertos]

With the High elven history of Magic use in the Warcraft Lore I feel that giving High elf players the ability to play as warlocks would be a welcome class change to turtle wow

I don't see it being too difficult to give high elves the warlock option and like I said earlier lore wise it makes sense

[Gheor]

Lorewise it makes no sense whatsoever, the whole breach into the civilization and community of high elves and blood elves was caused by using fel magic.

They also have all slots taken.

[Shatterfury]

Let`s not even forget that warlocks shouldn`t BE playable for the Horde or the Alliance. But the class mechanics were quite attractive and design won over lore and that is why we even have them in the first place.

[Lahire]

Let`s not even forget that warlocks shouldn`t BE playable for the Horde or the Alliance. But the class mechanics were quite attractive and design won over lore and that is why we even have them in the first place.

Warlocks are part of the horde in warcraft 2.

[Gheor]

Warcraft II Horde wasn't this Horde.

[Lahire]

Warcraft II Horde wasn't this Horde.

There also is a warlock friendly with Thrall during the warcraft 3 campaign. Optional quest of mission 2 TFT orc campaign.

Even if warlocks deal with evil deeds, they were never forbidden to participate in the horde after warcraft 2. Most war2 warlocks didn't want to be part of the war3 horde, not the other way around (they still wanted to follow war2 horde principles and goals). Then they accepted to be reincorporated into the horde sometimes between war3 and wow. It's like the door was always open, but during war3, for just this little time (what's the duration of war3 story ? like 2 or 3 years ?), they didn't want to come.

Their absence in war3 units is probably because it would be redundant with the orc shaman (game design reason, not lore reason).

[Shatterfury]

Warcraft II Horde wasn't this Horde.

There also is a warlock friendly with Thrall during the warcraft 3 campaign. Optional quest of mission 2 TFT orc campaign.

Even if warlocks deal with evil deeds, they were never forbidden to participate in the horde after warcraft 2. Most war2 warlocks didn't want to be part of the war3 horde, not the other way around (they still wanted to follow war2 horde principles and goals). Then they accepted to be reincorporated into the horde sometimes between war3 and wow. It's like the door was always open, but during war3, for just this little time (what's the duration of war3 story ? like 2 or 3 years ?), they didn't want to come.

Their absence in war3 units is probably because it would be redundant with the orc shaman (game design reason, not lore reason).

Thrall just left an old orc to live what days he had left. That orc also seemed to be haunted by the horrors he unleashed.
That encounter is not an indication of Thrall tolerating warlocks at all.

The thing is we don`t know for sure he was a warlock to begin with, there are skeletons there, he might be a necrolyte.

[Zhohan]

If you look at the mechanics of the Blood Mage in Warcraft 3, it plays a lot like a destro warlock. Banish and Siphon Mana being warlock abilities in the MMO. Flamestrike is a mage ability though.

[Jcarrill0]

Has everyone forgotten that Warcraft 3, Human Alliance Blood Elf Hero was a Blood Mage? Its a warlock guys...TurtleWoW High Elf Warlocks makes perfect sense!
I personally believe that when Blizzard wanted to add Paladins to the Horde, they had the 6 slot issue as well, and decided to remove Warriors and replace them with Paladins, but never wanted to remove the idea of Warlocks aka Blood Mages due to the fact it was Lore based.

[Sinrek]

Has everyone forgotten that Warcraft 3, Human Alliance Blood Elf Hero was a Blood Mage? Its a warlock guys...TurtleWoW High Elf Warlocks makes perfect sense!
I personally believe that when Blizzard wanted to add Paladins to the Horde, they had the 6 slot issue as well, and decided to remove Warriors and replace them with Paladins, but never wanted to remove the idea of Warlocks aka Blood Mages due to the fact it was Lore based.

Not really. Warlocks were never welcome in any faction if you take a closer look. For High Elves they were like a thorn in your side for many years since those way too inquisitive sorcerers give more than just a bad reputation to their whole race. They bring literally demons to the world who wreacks havoc and destruction only since they serve the Legion.

High Elf warlock would only be an exile and exiles are there in numbers following Kael'thas into Outlands and sate their hunger with fel instead of trying to cope with normal methods that arcane and priests of Holy Light had developed over those years. So basically they discarded their racial effort in favour of individual lust for power.

Glad to see you back, Jcarillo.

[Aeliren]

From the Wowpedia description about the Warcraft III Blood Mage:
"Many of the stoic high elves, reeling from the loss of their ancient homeland, Quel'Thalas, have given in to their hatred and despair and embraced the dark side of their magical natures. Calling themselves 'Blood Elves' - these cold hearted refugees seek to expand their remaining magical powers at any cost - even if it means courting the infernal powers of the Burning Legion! Though still loyal to the Alliance, the Blood Elves' passions will lead them not only to the highest pinnacles of power, but to the darkest depths of madness."

A high elf warlock is just a blood elf at this point. Biologically the same, but there's a political and ideological difference that was created when Kael'thas rallied those of his people that he could and joined Garithos' forces, and later Illidan and Lady Vashj.

I am on the fence about this, mostly because I'm not sure what Turtle WoW's version of Silvermoon is like and what it's relation to Alah'thalas is. My assumption, which us based on the high elf racials, starting zone, and the founding of Alah'thalas, is that they would be separate from Silvermoon as a political entity and not accept the demonic magic that Kael'thas offered as a substitute to the Sunwell, given that they rely on meditation, they're travelling far south as refugees and are establishing a new home, thus making them politically distinct from the Blood Elves of Silvermoon that hypothetically would be more open to these new, reckless teachings. So the Alliance-aligned High Elves of Alah'thalas (playable High Elves) would likely not have Blood Mages (Warlocks), whereas the independent Blood Elves of Silvermoon (unplayable High Elves) could.

The reason I could potentially consider it is if high elf warlocks were thematically blood elves living amongst them (much like how troll priests are thematically witch doctors, night elf priests are priests/priestesses of the Moon, etc.), as per WCIII lore they would likely be amongst those most devout to Kael'thas' quest and his teachings, yet some could still be loyal to the Alliance. As they court the powers of the Legion, they would likely still be unwelcome amongst their kind and would be barely tolerated outcasts in a society already comprised of refugees, though as warlock quests demonstrate that's the standard reaction to warlocks for pretty much every race except the Forsaken.

That being said, all lore discussions aside there would still be the issue of the maximum of six classes, and I don't think anything can be done about that.

[Jcarrill0]

From the Wowpedia description about the Warcraft III Blood Mage:
"Many of the stoic high elves, reeling from the loss of their ancient homeland, Quel'Thalas, have given in to their hatred and despair and embraced the dark side of their magical natures. Calling themselves 'Blood Elves' - these cold hearted refugees seek to expand their remaining magical powers at any cost - even if it means courting the infernal powers of the Burning Legion! Though still loyal to the Alliance, the Blood Elves' passions will lead them not only to the highest pinnacles of power, but to the darkest depths of madness."

A high elf warlock is just a blood elf at this point. Biologically the same, but there's a political and ideological difference that was created when Kael'thas rallied those of his people that he could and joined Garithos' forces, and later Illidan and Lady Vashj.

I am on the fence about this, mostly because I'm not sure what Turtle WoW's version of Silvermoon is like and what it's relation to Alah'thalas is. My assumption, which us based on the high elf racials, starting zone, and the founding of Alah'thalas, is that they would be separate from Silvermoon as a political entity and not accept the demonic magic that Kael'thas offered as a substitute to the Sunwell, given that they rely on meditation, they're travelling far south as refugees and are establishing a new home, thus making them politically distinct from the Blood Elves of Silvermoon that hypothetically would be more open to these new, reckless teachings. So the Alliance-aligned High Elves of Alah'thalas (playable High Elves) would likely not have Blood Mages (Warlocks), whereas the independent Blood Elves of Silvermoon (unplayable High Elves) could.

The reason I could potentially consider it is if high elf warlocks were thematically blood elves living amongst them (much like how troll priests are thematically witch doctors, night elf priests are priests/priestesses of the Moon, etc.), as per WCIII lore they would likely be amongst those most devout to Kael'thas' quest and his teachings, yet some could still be loyal to the Alliance. As they court the powers of the Legion, they would likely still be unwelcome amongst their kind and would be barely tolerated outcasts in a society already comprised of refugees, though as warlock quests demonstrate that's the standard reaction to warlocks for pretty much every race except the Forsaken.

That being said, all lore discussions aside there would still be the issue of the maximum of six classes, and I don't think anything can be done about that.

So if I want to make a Blood Mage, how would I go about that in TurtleWoW?

[Lahire]

Turtle WoW's race is not Blood Elves but High Elves. You are not playing Kael'Thas friendies, but the elves who rejected them and stayed in Silvermoon.
So the description of Blood Mage cannot be used as a nudge for Helf warlock, because this character is the enemy of the Helves and not who you are playing as.

Helf warlocks are in Outland vibing with their rockstar Kael'Thas.

[Gheor]

And what a rockstar he is.

[Jcarrill0]

Turtle WoW's race is not Blood Elves but High Elves. You are not playing Kael'Thas friendies, but the elves who rejected them and stayed in Silvermoon.
So the description of Blood Mage cannot be used as a nudge for Helf warlock, because this character is the enemy of the Helves and not who you are playing as.

Helf warlocks are in Outland vibing with their rockstar Kael'Thas.

Did we not have Warcraft 3 Human hero as a Blood Mage? How can I recreate that here? I could also purchase a Blood Elf Skin, and an Illusion before that so... don't tell me I can't when its all based on warcraft 3 lore!

[Shatterfury]

The Blood Mage, judging by it`s spells is an angry Fire Mage who has pushed the limit of the Arcane a bit more, NOT an Warlock.

And I`d like to underline that Arcane magic itself IS dangerous as the Night Elves rightfully point out and had a corrupting effect. Arcane is akin to pot, Fel is pure heroine. You can be a normal person and use the first, but the second one will wreak you.

And don`t try to point out to existing playable warlocks, as far I am concerned it is a playable class because it is COOL, the lore explications are just excuses. Since it is in game from 2004, it has remained a playable class, no one would be ok with removing a playable class.

So to answer the question of playing a Blood Mage : High Elf Fire Mage with the Blood Elf skin.

[Jcarrill0]

The Blood Mage, judging by it`s spells is an angry Fire Mage who has pushed the limit of the Arcane a bit more, NOT an Warlock.

https://wowpedia.fandom.com/wiki/Blood_ ... _abilities

And I`d like to underline that Arcane magic itself IS dangerous as the Night Elves rightfully point out and had a corrupting effect. Arcane is akin to pot, Fel is pure heroine. You can be a normal person and use the first, but the second one will wreak you.

Mystical heroes, blood mages (a.k.a. bloodmages, sometimes blood magi or bloodmagi are blood elves adept at controlling magic and ranged assault. While they were still members of the Alliance, the blood elves began to turn to the darkest parts of magic, abandoning the water and frost spells of the Kirin Tor for the fire and heat of what some people fear to be demonic magic.

Sounds like a Warlock to me.

[Shatterfury]

Sounds like a Warlock to me.

No summoned daemon, life drain or any shadow or fel based attacks.

Two powerful fire spells, a mana drain and a banish spell who could have been wielded by almost all types of casters.

Pretty Fire Mage to me. Bear in mind that the Human Archmage is water based with two preeminent water based spells: a timed summon and AOE spell.

[Jcarrill0]

Sounds like a Warlock to me.

No summoned daemon, life drain or any shadow or fel based attacks.

Two powerful fire spells, a mana drain and a banish spell who could have been wielded by almost all types of casters.

Pretty spell Fire Mage to me. Bear in mind that the Human Archmage is water based with two preeminent water based spells: a timed summon and AOE spell.

You under the impression warlocks only do Shadow Damage, when that's simply not true, look into the third tech tree called Detruction, and see that its Fire spells, plus I don't know any mages who can drain mana or banish, while I know all warlocks can do that

[Shatterfury]

You under the impression warlocks only do Shadow Damage, when that's simply not true, look into the third tech tree called Detruction, and see that its Fire spells, plus I don't know any mages who can drain mana or banish, while I know all warlocks can do that

Both mana drain and banish are too generalist to be classified as warlock only, those are found in WoW, in the arsenal of Warlocks and not Mages for balance reasons, not for the lack of lore justifications.

I would argue that mana drain fits Arcane mages the best thematic wise.

As for banish I`d like to point out that Tauren casters in WC3 could cast a form of banish on themselves, so by no means a warlock exclusive spell.

Sorry, but I don`t see it, Blood Mages are Blood Elf Fire Mages, this is how I saw them and you are the first one to try to fit them in the warlock category.

And to further go into in, WHEN could have the Blood Elves have learnt Fel Magic? Certainly NOT before setting foot in Outland. The Blood Mage we are playing, Kael, in the Human campaign, is just an angry Fire Mage at that point.

As underlined by the devs, we are playing the High Elves, the part of the Thalassian Elves who has refused to syphon mana from demons, hack they might have left Quel`Thalas before Romath even returning to teach the remaining Elves in Quel`Thalas how to syphon mana from demons, and the other arsenal of warlock spells.

At this point the split between High Elves and Blood Elves is a doctrinary one, and being Warlocks IS certanly NOT a High Elf move.

[Jcarrill0]

At this point the split between High Elves and Blood Elves is a doctrinary one, and being Warlocks IS certanly NOT a High Elf move.

None of which were paladins, but that's a different story. Paladins were not introduced until after BLood Elves left the alliance and joined the horde, and on top of that it was the blood elves who were draining a Naaru to get the holy magic... so... yeah...

I'm pretty sure, Blood Mages came before Paladins.
If you use the lore that High Elves became Paladins, they story can still be said for Blood Mages.
Take Death Knights for example. There is 3 different Death Knights through out the lore, Not One and only one certain way to become a death knight.

I just want to make a Blood Mage, And the best way in my eyes would to be:
A warlock. I get Banish (no other class lets me do), I get Siphon Mana/Drain Mana (Which I haven't seen mages do in the game yet). I don't get Flame Strike (which is a mage ability), but I also don't get to summon a phoenix (But I did plan to get one from the Turlte Shop)

[Sinrek]

At this point the split between High Elves and Blood Elves is a doctrinary one, and being Warlocks IS certanly NOT a High Elf move.

None of which were paladins, but that's a different story. Paladins were not introduced until after BLood Elves left the alliance and joined the horde, and on top of that it was the blood elves who were draining a Naaru to get the holy magic... so... yeah...

I'm pretty sure, Blood Mages came before Paladins.
If you use the lore that High Elves became Paladins, they story can still be said for Blood Mages.
Take Death Knights for example. There is 3 different Death Knights through out the lore, Not One and only one certain way to become a death knight.

I just want to make a Blood Mage, And the best way in my eyes would to be:
A warlock. I get Banish (no other class lets me do), I get Siphon Mana/Drain Mana (Which I haven't seen mages do in the game yet). I don't get Flame Strike (which is a mage ability), but I also don't get to summon a phoenix (But I did plan to get one from the Turlte Shop)

Paladin class was developed by humans. Humans taught dwarves the art of healing for paladins and brought them into paladinhood so to speak. Since part of High Elves (rather remaining pile of'em) joined the Alliance and got accommodated in Stormwind City… so… yeah.

[Jcarrill0]

At this point the split between High Elves and Blood Elves is a doctrinary one, and being Warlocks IS certanly NOT a High Elf move.

None of which were paladins, but that's a different story. Paladins were not introduced until after BLood Elves left the alliance and joined the horde, and on top of that it was the blood elves who were draining a Naaru to get the holy magic... so... yeah...

I'm pretty sure, Blood Mages came before Paladins.
If you use the lore that High Elves became Paladins, they story can still be said for Blood Mages.
Take Death Knights for example. There is 3 different Death Knights through out the lore, Not One and only one certain way to become a death knight.

I just want to make a Blood Mage, And the best way in my eyes would to be:
A warlock. I get Banish (no other class lets me do), I get Siphon Mana/Drain Mana (Which I haven't seen mages do in the game yet). I don't get Flame Strike (which is a mage ability), but I also don't get to summon a phoenix (But I did plan to get one from the Turlte Shop)

Paladin class was developed by humans. Humans taught dwarves the art of healing for paladins and brought them into paladinhood so to speak. Since part of High Elves (rather remaining pile of'em) joined the Alliance and got accommodated in Stormwind City… so… yeah.

I was by no means saying They couldn't be Paladins, But I am saying you cant say High Elves cant be Warlocks, yet can be Paladins, I do understand the limitations of 6 classes, but when I'm told they don't fit as a warlock class (lore being Blood Mage), The idea of a Paladin comes into question since Blood Mages were around before the idea of Paladins came into existence.

I personally believe when the idea behind Blood Elves was created, they decided to REMOVE Warriors to add Paladins, since there was 6 class limit. I just like the fact they have a way to make Blood Mages. I would like to create one. that is all. When someone comes to defend and explain how if doesn't fit, I will gladly debate how it fits more then my own favorite class (which is a a paladin)

The idea is plausible, we just have to figure out how to overcome the 6 class limit.

[Sinrek]

I was by no means saying They couldn't be Paladins, But I am saying you cant say High Elves cant be Warlocks, yet can be Paladins.

Warlocks in the High Elf race are now Blood Elves. So they (High Elves) can't.

[Jcarrill0]

I was by no means saying They couldn't be Paladins, But I am saying you cant say High Elves cant be Warlocks, yet can be Paladins.

Warlocks in the High Elf race are now Blood Elves. So they (High Elves) can't.

I will gladly pay for a a Blood Elf look if it meant I could be a Blood Mage for RP purposes. I have no issues donating to the cause Turtle WoW has created. I just want to be a Warlock as its what they are.

[Sinrek]

I was by no means saying They couldn't be Paladins, But I am saying you cant say High Elves cant be Warlocks, yet can be Paladins.

Warlocks in the High Elf race are now Blood Elves. So they (High Elves) can't.

I will gladly pay for a a Blood Elf look if it meant I could be a Blood Mage for RP purposes. I have no issues donating to the cause Turtle WoW has created.

WIP. I'm sure it's already possible to recreate Blood Elf Mage wannabe if you go Destruction (Conflagration) based Affliction warlock with your, let's say a human, and slap a High Elf / Blood Elf illusion over it. Although, as I see it, it'd be best to just make a High Elf Mage with Fire/Arcane spec.

[Jcarrill0]

Warlocks in the High Elf race are now Blood Elves. So they (High Elves) can't.

I will gladly pay for a a Blood Elf look if it meant I could be a Blood Mage for RP purposes. I have no issues donating to the cause Turtle WoW has created.

WIP. I'm sure it's already possible to recreate Blood Elf Mage wannabe if you go Destruction (Conflagration) based Affliction warlock with your, let's say a human, and slap a High Elf / Blood Elf illusion over it. Although, as I see it, it'd be best to just make a High Elf Mage with Fire/Arcane spec.

I was told the illusion was removed in replacement for the skin.
I used to have the illusion on my Human warrior and it was removed once I returned to play TurtleWoW. (its still in my action bar as proof as well)

[Shatterfury]

At this point the split between High Elves and Blood Elves is a doctrinary one, and being Warlocks IS certanly NOT a High Elf move.

None of which were paladins, but that's a different story. Paladins were not introduced until after BLood Elves left the alliance and joined the horde, and on top of that it was the blood elves who were draining a Naaru to get the holy magic... so... yeah...

I'm pretty sure, Blood Mages came before Paladins.
If you use the lore that High Elves became Paladins, they story can still be said for Blood Mages.
Take Death Knights for example. There is 3 different Death Knights through out the lore, Not One and only one certain way to become a death knight.

I just want to make a Blood Mage, And the best way in my eyes would to be:
A warlock. I get Banish (no other class lets me do), I get Siphon Mana/Drain Mana (Which I haven't seen mages do in the game yet). I don't get Flame Strike (which is a mage ability), but I also don't get to summon a phoenix (But I did plan to get one from the Turlte Shop)

You are a persistent one.
The High Elves certainly had contact with the concept of the Light for hundreds of years given that the Humans and Elves had a good relation due to them butchering the Forest Trolls like 2700 years ago.

The Elves were the Priests in the Human campaign, so to assume that the High Elves are incapable of being Paladins is silly. Their numbers are certainty fewer, the Elves focused on the Arcane more but they knew about the Light for a lot of more time than they knew about fel magic.

You can persist in your stuborness all you want, Kael, WAS NOT A WARLOCK in the Human campaign, Blood Mages are Blood Elf Fire Mages.

[Jcarrill0]

The High Elves certainly had contact with the concept of the Light for hundreds of years given that the Humans and Elves had a good relation due to them butchering the Forest Trolls like 2700 years ago.

I agree with that.

The Elves were the Priests in the Human campaign, so to assume that the High Elves are incapable of being Paladins is silly. Their numbers are certainty fewer, the Elves focused on the Arcane more but they knew about the Light for a lot of more time than they knew about fel magic.

The Priest were not brought into the church of the Holy Light though like the dwarves were.

Blood elves follow, or at least did when they were high elves, the Holy Light just like humans and dwarves. Unlike the two others however, who derive their power from faith alone, high elf and blood elf priests seem to derive theirs from other sources.The first of these was the Sunwell, brought to end by the Scourge during the Third War when it was used to resurrect the Kel'thuzad.

I hope you can see how that fits as priests.

You can persist in your stuborness all you want, Kael, WAS NOT A WARLOCK in the Human campaign, Blood Mages are Blood Elf Fire Mages.

I never said he was, I'm saying if i want to RP as a Blood Mage as a warlock, I never said anything about Prince Kael'Thas