Turtle WoW is expanding to the East!

[Torta]

Greetings, everyone! This announcement is primarily for those of you playing from China. We are excited to announce that after careful consideration, we have chosen to launch a new realm hosted in Asia! We have selected a Chinese-speaking team to represent, translate, and manage a server in China. They will uphold the values and standards of our European realm and will be fully responsible for player support, translation work, client localization, communication, and realm promotion.

The new branch of our project will be hosted on cn.turtle-wow.org. Please follow this website for any further news regarding the Chinese realm.

So, what will be different? Here are the key changes:

• Native Chinese-speaking support in-game and in QQ groups.

• Full translation of Vanilla and Mystery of Azeroth's quests into Chinese.

• Official Chinese client.

• Mirrored update release schedule (with slight delays for translation)

World events such as the AQ Gate opening event and Scourge invasion will be repeated CN realm.

Additionally, we will be providing gradual free transfers from the EU realm to the CN realm. This means that those who wish to play in their native language can join the leveling community on the Chinese realm after a specified lockout time which depends on the character's progression and the progression of the new realm. More details on this timeline will be published with the launch date of the new realm.

We believe that this step is necessary to ensure a healthy gameplay experience for both realms. The main reason we are doing this is twofold:

• For a long time we have been unable to provide proper support to a large community on our server due to language barriers. This includes moderating chats or addressing their concerns and troubles.

Due to these same language barriers we have seen increasing discontent with players not being able to properly interact with each other. This goes directly against the spirit of the game which encourages players to cooperate and make new friends.

Turtle WoW QQ group: 893443054
Administrator: 尊（QQ：1503272976）

Please stay tuned for more announcements coming later this month, including class changes applications.

[Ingameacc12345]

Praise the $deity.

[Balake]

"World events such as the AQ Gate opening event and Scourge invasion will be repeated on both EU and CN realms."
on both EU and CN realms means the event to open AQ40 and naxxramas gates will repeat on the current fully progressed EU realm?
If that's true, how will it work.
Will the raids close and have a short event to be reopened, or will they continue to be open but with the event existing there on the side?

If AQ40 gates event happens again, that means new chances to get scarab lord title and mount?

[Dated]

I FUCKING love turtlewow. i play this game 21 hours a day with 2 hours to sleep and even when i do sleep i wake up SHAKING in a cold sweat wanting to play turtlewow. im PHYSICALLY ill when im not playing turtlewow. this is what i call DEDICATION!!

[Gladeshadow]

This is a great and much needed change. Thank you for paying attention to the players saying that it was becoming far too crowded.

[Bigsmerf]

Oh thank god finally... I've been waiting so long to quest...

[Urimeli]

World events such as the AQ Gate opening event and Scourge invasion will be repeated on both EU and CN realms.

This is a horrible idea that would only cause frustration, IF you are expecting 4k~ people to complete the quest chain. Just imagine the competition for Broodlord head when were this far progressed.

[Geojak]

Regarding the repeat of the events. Especially, the scourge even is pretty fun, it even offers lots of bonus mini bosses in low level instances. And the necropolis attacks for high levels.

I would like to suggest to automate this into a seasonal event just like fire festivsl, halloween and so on. Just pick a week, for example first and second week in October. Idk sometime you like and do it every year same to for another annual scourge invasion. It would be very cool

Similiar coild be done for aq40 event in a smaller scope. The 24h war time with special bosses and stuff is also fun, but Overally the scourge event would be better for a seasonal event suited.

[Samsara]

I'm not a fan of separate realms. Should be layers at most. Why can't I make Chinese friends? At this rate give a realm to Russians, to Americans, to Latin Americans, etc.
Is it too much to ask that we get to vote on it? The racists are way too loud about their dislike of the Chinese.

[Redmagejoe]

I'm not a fan of separate realms. Should be layers at most. Why can't I make Chinese friends? At this rate give a realm to Russians, to Americans, to Latin Americans, etc.
Is it too much to ask that we get to vote on it? The racists are way too loud about their dislike of the Chinese.

No. Whether you like it or not, there is a very strong, intrinsic difference in social attitudes that impact online gaming in China compared to even other parts of Southeast Asia, let alone the West. It may sound reductive, but even Chinese-American and Chinese-Canadian players will tell you that you really cannot cultivate a community where mainland Chinese gamers and Western gamers can coexist.

The culture of mainland China itself would have to change, and that would take a great, great, great deal of time. Far beyond the scope of our small server. The best thing to do is keep these two communities apart, as sad as that is to say.

[Bowser]

For example, the majority of our Spanish-speaking players know the basics of the English language. The same applies to our Russian community; most of them also understand English just fine.

However, the majority of our Chinese community does not understand English and cannot read Pinyin, making communication essentially impossible.

We will do our best to create an attractive realm in order to encourage the majority to move.

[Fizzler]

Are we allowed to type in English on the Chinese realm? I assume the Chinese realm will just include Mandarin as a language requirement alongside English and that I can change my realmlist easily on the English client if I want to play solo and ignore everyone else.

[Redmagejoe]

Are we allowed to type in English on the Chinese realm? I assume the Chinese realm will just include Mandarin as a language requirement alongside English and that I can change my realmlist easily on the English client if I want to play solo and ignore everyone else.

I feel like given the point of the separate realms, it's more likely to the two realms will be region-locked.

[Arthur222]

I don't understand why this behaviour is a "final solution." It sounds like some segregation; I know the negative image of my people in the West, and in Azeroth, we seem to be associated with RMT and bot and any other negative thing you can imagine. I understand your approach; after all, throwing the problem to a group with a "bad reputation" seems very cost-effective.

Of course, no one can deny that our world is increasingly conservative and aggressive. Everyone has started to blame others for their problems, whether political economy or culture. It's easier to place a mocking Target Dummy than solve the problem, right?

We Chinese always like to say: Harmony in diversity. I studied international relations in Australia and dream of building peace in a world of strife. My experience in Turtle Wow was happy, with players from anywhere. The world is exceptionally peaceful as long as you ignore Goldshire and the Disgraced at the Crossroads.

Turtle Wow has gained attention on Chinese social media in the last two months. For us, it is Avalon. I noticed this phenomenon very early on, and since then, I began to wonder what your response would be. I fantasized about inclusive peace, but it seems that neither of us is good enough to build Avalon, And finally, on my own behalf, I'm sorry if my screed made you feel uncomfortable.so be it if you don't welcome us, here to quote one of my favourite Western movies, Good Morning, and in case I don't see you, Good afternoon, Good evening, And good night.

[Samsara]

I'm not a fan of separate realms. Should be layers at most. Why can't I make Chinese friends? At this rate give a realm to Russians, to Americans, to Latin Americans, etc.
Is it too much to ask that we get to vote on it? The racists are way too loud about their dislike of the Chinese.

No. Whether you like it or not, there is a very strong, intrinsic difference in social attitudes that impact online gaming in China compared to even other parts of Southeast Asia, let alone the West. It may sound reductive, but even Chinese-American and Chinese-Canadian players will tell you that you really cannot cultivate a community where mainland Chinese gamers and Western gamers can coexist.

The culture of mainland China itself would have to change, and that would take a great, great, great deal of time. Far beyond the scope of our small server. The best thing to do is keep these two communities apart, as sad as that is to say.

This is so fucking wrong and I already made a Chinese friend. I've had more issues with Americans whining about timings favoring Europe than I've had with Chinese altogether. In fact I've learnt the Chinese people learn English more often than they learn Korean or Japanese which surprised me. I am very much against separating us while the other continents are put together. I want a freaking vote and your disagreeing doesn't invalidate my experience. And for the record, cultural affinity is a thing. I fucking hate the culture of my country, and I like Chinese culture. So go be racist somewhere else please. And with the current world events, without diving into politics, now more than ever is the time to bond. Not segregate.

[Redmagejoe]

So go be racist somewhere else please.

And with this, you've forfeit the entire discussion. You can hide your ignorance of sociopolitical, socioeconomic, and cultural differences across the world, and sociology behind your buzzwords all you want, but please do not use that same ignorance to jab a finger at people who understand these topics better than you. You have no idea what my ethnic or cultural background is, yet you so freely speak on preconceived notions. Sounds pretty bigoted to me.

Regardless, you don't get a vote. Staff just made it clear that they've been working towards this for a long time and have made their decision. This project isn't a democracy. If you don't like it, leave. Continue to throw a tantrum while people are having civil discussions, and you will be sanctioned. That's how the server works.

[Reploidrocsa]

Great news! those chinese who don't really integrate in our current comunity can have their own space with proper chinese speaking staff, and those who are already integrated can stay in the main server. Finally some population balance will happen, it's a bit overcrowded out here :D

[Diorum1]

Based on Torta's and Bowser's wording of offering transfers and to encourage the majority to move it sounds completely opt in.

[Thyx]

Well atleast we can have alittle more lax PvP brackets... Maybe...

[Yuzhouxingren]

Would the Chinese server be open to anyone? If not, will the client-side changes be available on the EU server as well? I know that sometimes, it's a lot harder to get into a Chinese server than it is the other way around.

I'm not Chinese, and don't have a Mainland QQ account, but I've been trying to use language pack addons etc to get TWoW running in Mandarin because I'm trying to learn Chinese and for someone like me the chance to play the game on an L2 client and study while I play is what I need to justify the time I spend in the game.

[Mythox]

I think this is a brilliant execution of Twow offering there player base diversity and inclusion, less QQ spam in channels in game and freedom to express yourself within the server chat rulesets, honestly blown away by how quick Twow adapts for the greater good of the majority playerbase and will happily continue donating here to show support for a game community i love .

[Cnkun]

This is a good decision

[Getplucked]

Of course, no one can deny that our world is increasingly conservative and aggressive. Everyone has started to blame others for their problems, whether political economy or culture. It's easier to place a mocking Target Dummy than solve the problem, right?

We Chinese always like to say: Harmony in diversity. I studied international relations in Australia and dream of building peace in a world of strife. My experience in Turtle Wow was happy, with players from anywhere. The world is exceptionally peaceful as long as you ignore Goldshire and the Disgraced at the Crossroads.

Chill with the victim complex.

This has nothing to do with "ree racism ree". The only "problem" here is the fact that english and chinese players cannot communicate effectively with each other due to the language barrier. That's it. And thus, Chinese players are getting their own server so we don't run into this problem of communication failure.

It's the same reason why there are separate language servers for pretty much every online game where communication is necessary. You can't have "diversity" when doing so causes gameplay issues due to language barriers.

[Xerilin]

I feel like something needs to be done to reduce growth of the server to maintain a friendly environment. This is a good solution for everybody and less controversial than a seperate hc server and the usual "just make another realm" suggestions. Chinese players get an official localization (how cool is that? I know many people who would love one in their own language) and the rest of us get a smaller realm. Win win.

[Artrain]

I'm not a fan of separate realms. Should be layers at most. Why can't I make Chinese friends? At this rate give a realm to Russians, to Americans, to Latin Americans, etc.
Is it too much to ask that we get to vote on it? The racists are way too loud about their dislike of the Chinese.

I very much agree with you.

[Artrain]

Thank you for your attention to Chinese players. As a Chinese deeply aware of the virtues of Chinese. If you open a game server separately, you are very worried about the rampant operation of the studio. And the collaborators you're contacting right now are very likely studio-type people. I really don't want to see a separate Asian server, thank you.

[Holyhorrorr]

Will the PvP for battlegrounds be cross-realm?

[Resident]

а где наш великий и могучий язык ?? где наш перевод ?? это же не сложно в наше время

[Sylveria]

To undermine the reason

Due to these same language barriers we have seen increasing discontent with players not being able to properly interact with each other. This goes directly against the spirit of the game which encourages players to cooperate and make new friends.

exclusion par excelence. that's not about "making friends", "meeting people" etc.

And to top it of, for anyone who's pulling the "racism"-card:

If it would be... let's say: the germans who would get an entire realm for their own. nobody, literally nobody in their right mind would say "that's racism". Quite the opposite would happen: Instead people would ask "Why don't we get our own realm?"

i for one congratulate the chinese players to their own realm.

[Samsara]

So go be racist somewhere else please.

And with this, you've forfeit the entire discussion. You can hide your ignorance of sociopolitical, socioeconomic, and cultural differences across the world, and sociology behind your buzzwords all you want, but please do not use that same ignorance to jab a finger at people who understand these topics better than you. You have no idea what my ethnic or cultural background is, yet you so freely speak on preconceived notions. Sounds pretty bigoted to me.

Ad Hominem ;)

Regardless, you don't get a vote. Staff just made it clear that they've been working towards this for a long time and have made their decision. This project isn't a democracy. If you don't like it, leave. Continue to throw a tantrum while people are having civil discussions, and you will be sanctioned. That's how the server works.

And you don't speak for the staff.

[Samsara]

Of course, no one can deny that our world is increasingly conservative and aggressive. Everyone has started to blame others for their problems, whether political economy or culture. It's easier to place a mocking Target Dummy than solve the problem, right?

We Chinese always like to say: Harmony in diversity. I studied international relations in Australia and dream of building peace in a world of strife. My experience in Turtle Wow was happy, with players from anywhere. The world is exceptionally peaceful as long as you ignore Goldshire and the Disgraced at the Crossroads.

Chill with the victim complex.

This has nothing to do with "ree racism ree". The only "problem" here is the fact that english and chinese players cannot communicate effectively with each other due to the language barrier. That's it. And thus, Chinese players are getting their own server so we don't run into this problem of communication failure.

It's the same reason why there are separate language servers for pretty much every online game where communication is necessary. You can't have "diversity" when doing so causes gameplay issues due to language barriers.

It is already a rule that languages other than English should be kept to private messages and guilds. Just enforce this rule, and add a separate general channel per zone that is okay with "international languages" (that people can opt-out of) and suddenly we can all play together without being spammed with Chinese (or Russian either) in regular channels, without casting them away. If it can be done for HC characters, it can be done for foreign speakers too.

[Elesion]

To undermine the reason

Due to these same language barriers we have seen increasing discontent with players not being able to properly interact with each other. This goes directly against the spirit of the game which encourages players to cooperate and make new friends.

exclusion par excelence. that's not about "making friends", "meeting people" etc.

This is the only issue I see as a real problem, and it strikes me as mostly a technical one. The client unable to render Chinese characters leaves us with empty messages like that, items or quests linked as [], etc. You can't even tell if they wrote a long or a short message, leaving you clueless and awkward (did they rant? did they just say "ok" or emote?). The language barrier itself can be overcome if both sides try. I've run with nice Chinese people who communicate in broken English and we made it work. Just tone down your own language a bit, ask when something is unclear, be open and friendly, etc. I've even run as a healer with a Chinese 4-stack that queued on LFT. Definitely less chatty than most groups (80% of their messages looked like in the picture), but also no real issues at all. The only fight we had problems with we could work it out using simple English. Incidentally I've also run with a German guild 4-stack and they posted about a third of party chat in German as well. So I don't see a very meaningful difference. The encoding issues and the usage of a different character set to begin with makes it seem less approachable than other nationalities but it's pretty much the same. Neither is probably trying to maliciously "exclude" people - they just want to chill while playing a game, so they type in a language that comes more easily to them.

Most Chinese I've encountered on the server were hc anyway, so their ability to communicate and cooperate didn't matter and matched that of EU/NA hc characters pretty much.

I'm fine with the new realm opening. There are real benefits for everyone (better support for Chinese especially non-English speaking ones, lower pop for everyone else). But I don't remotely think it's necessary to exclude or banish Chinese from the OG TWoW server due to cultural differences or anything like that. Integration was already slowly happening and probably would have increased as the months pass and we play together more. But as long as it's going to be an optional alternative I'm looking forward to playing with the Chinese players who choose to remain on the OG server.

I studied international relations in Australia and dream of building peace in a world of strife. My experience in Turtle Wow was happy, with players from anywhere. [...] I fantasized about inclusive peace, but it seems that neither of us is good enough to build Avalon,

That's a very nice fantasy to have and probably a quite sober truthful realization that both sides aren't ready for it. When faced with cultural differences humans tend to fall back to tribal "in-group vs out-group" thinking way too easily to build a true paradise on Earth.

[Geojak]

Will the PvP for battlegrounds be cross-realm?

That woukd be great

[Sleeplust]

You apparently know that the team operating Turtle WOW in east Asia isn't truly supportive to your "values and standards".
No matter how you made agreement with the "gold sellers" or "GDKP leaders" faking their loyalty as your agent of east Asian Turtle WOW, my concern is if you provide "refugee adminssion" for accounts or characters transfered from the original Turtle WOW server to localised Asian server when the Asian server is down due to legal or economic issues. After all, Blizzard CWOW is about to be online within this year.
Last but not least, if you find yourselves tolerent to Russian players who occupy a great proportion of population in the game, ignore your conventional order and use Cyrillic alphabet in public channels (or even sell gold), why there is a double standard of tolerence, or distaste, to Chinese players?

[Syrathegreat]

For example, the majority of our Spanish-speaking players know the basics of the English language. The same applies to our Russian community; most of them also understand English just fine.

However, the majority of our Chinese community does not understand English and cannot read Pinyin, making communication essentially impossible.

This just isn't true.

The Chinese school curriculum includes English, and China statistically has a similar level of basic English literacy (6%) to other non-anglophone countries such as Russia (5%), Brazil (5%), and South Korea (10%).

What they often do lack is practice speaking English which comes with welcome interaction with the international community which is what everyone else does when they're young and starting out on the internet.

Although I do welcome the opening of a Pacific server, the way this has been pitched as specifically a solution to move the Chinese population off the EU servers, as well as announcing it at 4am Chinese time for no reason and in English, really puts a sour taste in my mouth and makes it seem as if this is really an attempt to mitigate the rampant sinophobia we've seen on the server lately, rather than any real support for our Chinese playerbase.