Manletow wrote: ↑Fri May 24, 2024 5:54 pm
*snip*
You seem to be all over the forums at this point, lmao. Still trying to nerf Paladins into the ground because you hate them so much. Your bias is pretty clear from your signature, but your posts are even worse than that.
Might help to try out and play EVERY class to 60 in both PvP and PvE for about a month. After that, you get to talk about class balances and design. If you can't manage that, the official Blizzard forums are a great place for whiners.
PvP and PvE balance needs to be done separately so as not to mess up the classes for either situation. Nerf PvP damage if they have too much burst? Sure ok but it doesn't affect PvE damage. PvP gear honestly is overdue for some PvP-specific modifiers like reduced/increased PvP damage, etc. Or just remove PvP gear altogether and have everyone choose stat boosts like Guild Wars 2 does. Don't think that would go over well with PvPers though so that might be nice for a later custom server.
I'd say the best way to really get some reliable/useful data on PvP specifically would be a 'test' server so that people can try out classes at whatever levels (or even only at level 60) and insta-learn professions/recipes and insta-acquire stuff like quest rewards or whatever. Blizzard already made a PvP tester NPC for this purpose and there are dedicated guides that go over a lot of such items:
https://www.wowhead.com/classic/guide/i ... lassic-pvp
-----The TLDR WishList for DPSing-----
For Turtle WoW specifically, I'd love to see some 'tiers' of classes done properly:
-Pure DPS Classes on top (squishy over tanky; melee should always beat ranged here)
-Dual-use DPS classes under them (those who can fulfill 2 roles)
-Hybrids who can do all 3 roles under that
So if it were me, DPS should be in order from highest to lowest; presuming 100% uptime on the enemy and variations in DPS because of raid mechanics and gear differences. This list presumes equal gear/skill.
--Rogue (leather, melee) -- Undisputed Top Dps; full stop
--Warrior (plate, melee) -- 1% lower than rogue
--Mage (cloth, ranged) -- 3% lower than Rogue
--Priest (cloth, ranged) -- 3% lower than Rogue
--Warlock (cloth, ranged, pet) - 3% lower than Rogue
--Druid (leather but bear form equals plate+, melee/ranged, hybrid) -- 5% lower than Rogue
--Hunter (mail, ranged physical dps, pet) -- 5% lower than Rogue
--Paladin (plate, melee/ranged, hybrid) -- 5% lower than Rogue
--Shaman (mail, melee/ranged, hybrid) -- 5% lower than Rogue
-----END OF LIST-----
People are so obsessed with DPS meters that if things are equalized without tier-specific effect-specific gear first (maybe 60 blues w/o set bonuses) and then people can min-max-meta however they like. You'd want mostly rogues and warriors in raids but the clothie dps would be awesome for some more steady dps and for phases where melee can't attack (like Onyxia Phase 2 as a well-known example).
One could argue that Hunters should do more damage, but honestly not having to worry about hit gear as much as melee dps does, not even having to worry about spell hit as much as casters do, having a pet for additional DPS (as mediocre as that might be), and having the single best 'Drop All Aggro' button in Feign Death means they can basically not worry about threat at all for the most part and go ham unlike the pure-casters.
With all the crap warriors have to deal with during leveling and even at 60, they deserve a spot alongside rogues and constantly within that 1% difference. It would be a healthy competition of both skill and gearing. Rogues naturally being the most-likely to be squishy and in melee range deserve that top spot without question.
While Warlocks have a pet, they're often using the pet in a supportive role rather than having it attack a raid boss due to both existing vanilla bugs and existing server raid boss scripting issues when it comes to pets in particular. This affects hunters less often because hunter pets are always out doing physical dps (for the most part) versus ranged spell dps on the warlock pet used most often in raids (Imp).
Shadow Priests cannot consistently heal (for the most part) while in Shadowform. I don't feel that they should suffer a 'hybrid' tax and should be competitive right alongside the other casters in both DPS output and group/raid utility. Mages get 3 schools of magic (arcane/frost/fire) and Warlocks get 2 of em (fire/shadow) so having Shadow priests ONLY being able to do shadow (or maybe swap to Holy spells if the PvE enemy is shadow immune) is enough of a 'tax' for their utility. As an offside bonus, making both Priests and Warriors doing more dps and thus having them be easier to level means less healer and tank shortages all around which benefits the entire server.
Druids, Paladins, and Shamans get a slight hybrid tax instead of the massive clusterpork that Blizz vanilla did, however by contrast they bring utility, buffs, survivability, and flexibility to the raid group. I specifically arranged each 'category' in alphabetical order to avoid any pretense of bias. I love a good Mage as much as a Warlock as much as that tasty mana/health regen of a Shadow Priest as much as a Boomkin's tasty spell crit buff as much as a Cat's melee crit buff as much as a Shaman's windfury totems as much as Pally buffs.
Rather than being hostile or hateful to any one class (Paladins or Shamans or otherwise) we should work together holistically towards a common goal (defeating the other team in PvP or defeating the raid bosses in PvE).
Every class is different so lets be chill and kind and awesome with one another. End of novella :P