Make WorldPvP great again

[Bjorn88]

World pvp is dead

As said, you (I assume) play on the pve server. Abscence of wpvp is a feature, not a bug.

Noshu described an area other than Alterac Valley. He, like myself, like to have a zone where you can sneak in with the hope of finding wealth while risking being thrashed. This is a series of gambling. Excitement. Give us that!

You just described the feeling on basically every endgame zone on a pvp server :) roll on Tel'Abim if that is what you want! I played on Nordanaar but realized after some raiding and BGs that there is basically no excitement in the game without world pvp. Last night on Tel'Abim Horde held BRM for a good hour and denied Alliance access to Burning Steppes and BRS. 30+ wpvp kills. Alliance guilds now often camp in BRM on raid days so Horde guilds now are starting to group up and collaborate to get in to MC and BWL (and wipe some Alliance mongrels on the way). A weak person would /cry and say that it's "toxic" behavior, I say that's what makes it a living server and adds skin in the game: There are consequences to where you go and how, so you have to watch your back and make choices.

[Rikkavil]

Thank you for sharing this with us Bjorn88.

[Noshu]

World pvp is dead

As said, you (I assume) play on the pve server. Abscence of wpvp is a feature, not a bug.

Noshu described an area other than Alterac Valley. He, like myself, like to have a zone where you can sneak in with the hope of finding wealth while risking being thrashed. This is a series of gambling. Excitement. Give us that!

You just described the feeling on basically every endgame zone on a pvp server :) roll on Tel'Abim if that is what you want! I played on Nordanaar but realized after some raiding and BGs that there is basically no excitement in the game without world pvp. Last night on Tel'Abim Horde held BRM for a good hour and denied Alliance access to Burning Steppes and BRS. 30+ wpvp kills. Alliance guilds now often camp in BRM on raid days so Horde guilds now are starting to group up and collaborate to get in to MC and BWL (and wipe some Alliance mongrels on the way). A weak person would /cry and say that it's "toxic" behavior, I say that's what makes it a living server and adds skin in the game: There are consequences to where you go and how, so you have to watch your back and make choices.

You're completely right, and I would play on Tel'abim if it wasnt dying. What you did in BRM sounds amazing, and I'd have loved that on a more populated realm. What Im asking for is just 1 zone on the main realm where there could be some world pvp action, nothing more.

[Stinkyjames]

I will say it again - PvP is dead, because people aren't interested in it. There was a very loud and vocal minority who demanded to be given a PvP server. Turtle WoW team gave them a PvP server, said PvP server died, because people realized PvP isn't as fun as they thought and they also realized they are a minority. There is no way to revive and revitalize PvP, because people just don't want to do it. It's only a matter of time before the PvP server is shut down or merged back into the PvE server. Hate me all you want, you will see it happen in the near future.

Nonsense. Pvp servers have always been more popular than pve servers. The initial boom on pvp server was due to the fresh chasers and a number of migrants from the pve server like myself (who got sick of a server where there is nothing to do except raid and BGs). Many then quit playing due to the unfortunate release of SoD and the negativity from individuals like yourself here and on discord - "these trolls who dont play on the server say it sucks, so it must suck".

That said though it would be good if the development team could give a headsup on their short term plans for the pvp server. It has an engaged community and lots of potential but we would appreciate some info on upcoming content release dates etc.

Yea I totally agree. The great private servers like nostalrius, elysium, light's hope, etc were all pvp servers. And the world felt very alive and dangerous. On turtle its just meh

Agreed, all the biggest servers in wow history have been pvp enabled. And all the big private servers I have played on were mainly pvp with pve just a means to get big hammers.

I think T-Wow, much like blizzard with wow until MoP has a giant cake ready to be frosted and sprinkled. But are failing to do so properly up until this point.

There have been some amazing things done in other mmo-s, great suggestions on the forums etc. I hope they find a way to implement an engaging way to make the server more alive.

[Ataika]

Agreed, all the biggest servers in wow history have been pvp enabled. And all the big private servers I have played on were mainly pvp with pve just a means to get big hammers.

Biggest =/= good
Your nostalrius was a lagging shithole with 20 yards view distance swarmed with bots and crossfaction mafia

[Stinkyjames]

Agreed, all the biggest servers in wow history have been pvp enabled. And all the big private servers I have played on were mainly pvp with pve just a means to get big hammers.

Biggest =/= good
Your nostalrius was a lagging shithole with 20 yards view distance swarmed with bots and crossfaction mafia

>Your
I never played Nostalrius. I am saying however that your comment lacked nuance and was mostly just silly statement slinging based on nothing but feelings.

[Ataika]

Agreed, all the biggest servers in wow history have been pvp enabled. And all the big private servers I have played on were mainly pvp with pve just a means to get big hammers.

Biggest =/= good
Your nostalrius was a lagging shithole with 20 yards view distance swarmed with bots and crossfaction mafia

>Your
I never played Nostalrius. I am saying however that your comment lacked nuance and was mostly just silly statement slinging based on nothing but feelings.

Obviously, because you are just_another_clueless_guy this forum is full of. Literally posting about anything you have no clue.
Nostalrius forum is sitll active, you can crawl there and check my words (however you might find even more reasons to call that server a trashcan it was).

Same goes for your all other examples, i bet you have never played them too.

[Stinkyjames]

Biggest =/= good
Your nostalrius was a lagging shithole with 20 yards view distance swarmed with bots and crossfaction mafia

>Your
I never played Nostalrius. I am saying however that your comment lacked nuance and was mostly just silly statement slinging based on nothing but feelings.

Obviously, because you are just_another_clueless_guy this forum is full of. Literally posting about anything you have no clue.
Nostalrius forum is sitll active, you can crawl there and check my words (however you might find even more reasons to call that server a trashcan it was).

Same goes for your all other examples, i bet you have never played them too.

I see that I have made the mistake of engaging someone who smokes crack in their spare time. This forum is not unlike how you describe nostalrius with the likes of you posting.

[Bigsmerf]

I think you're forgetting the tidbit where our friend here insinuated you were being rude. A pretty fair assessment, since one of your first conclusions to be made about a person was that they were in their 40s, lived in their mother's basement, and hadn't worked a day. Pretty heft stuff. Other hurtful things too, but hey- who's really counting?

Point is, I- and I assume everyone else who's spoken so far thinks it's not very christian of you going around and insulting people, then when your callous behavior is addressed you use your religion as some sort of excuse or reasoning for it. Or something along those lines? Eh, not sure. That's how it comes off to me.

Now that I think about it, wasn't talk of religions and other controversies banned here? Haven't you been on the server since 50 pop? Prolly should've picked up on that by now...

I haven't started any of that. I said PvP is dead, because people aren't interested in it. You are forgetting that my opinion triggered several people who then attacked me in all kinds of different ways. I wasn't the one who began suggesting who should "go outside" or talk about what profile pictures should be used or not.

Go back and read the posts above, in every of these situations you mention, I was provoked. I just stood my ground and now you are trying to demonize me for standing by my opinion that PvP is dead, because people aren't interested in it.

Look hard at yourself and the other people who obviously think they have a beef with me and see how you are twisting facts and trying to put words in my mouth to fit your narrative. This behavior is sociopathic and not normal. You can try to vilify me more if that floats your boat.

I will say it again - PvP is dead, because people aren't interested in it. There was a very loud and vocal minority who demanded to be given a PvP server. Turtle WoW team gave them a PvP server, said PvP server died, because people realized PvP isn't as fun as they thought and they also realized they are a minority. There is no way to revive and revitalize PvP, because people just don't want to do it. It's only a matter of time before the PvP server is shut down or merged back into the PvE server. Hate me all you want, you will see it happen in the near future.

I don't, I just find your personality extremely obnoxious.

Fantastic, carry on then.

TlDR since I'd rather not waste my time with this: Wrathful keyboard warrior goes on novel length tirade degrading a person for grammar mistakes, doles out insults and passive aggressive comments, and accuses naysayer of mental illness after one post they make because they also had a different take on the situation.

You sure you don't suffer from narcissism?

[Ataika]

>Your
I never played Nostalrius. I am saying however that your comment lacked nuance and was mostly just silly statement slinging based on nothing but feelings.

Obviously, because you are just_another_clueless_guy this forum is full of. Literally posting about anything you have no clue.
Nostalrius forum is sitll active, you can crawl there and check my words (however you might find even more reasons to call that server a trashcan it was).

Same goes for your all other examples, i bet you have never played them too.

I see that I have made the mistake of engaging someone who smokes crack in their spare time. This forum is not unlike how you describe nostalrius with the likes of you posting.

Yes you surely made a mistake posting about servers you did not xperience.
Glad you have aknowledged it

[Allwynd01]

I will say it again - PvP is dead, because people aren't interested in it. There was a very loud and vocal minority who demanded to be given a PvP server. Turtle WoW team gave them a PvP server, said PvP server died, because people realized PvP isn't as fun as they thought and they also realized they are a minority. There is no way to revive and revitalize PvP, because people just don't want to do it. It's only a matter of time before the PvP server is shut down or merged back into the PvE server. Hate me all you want, you will see it happen in the near future.

Nonsense. Pvp servers have always been more popular than pve servers. The initial boom on pvp server was due to the fresh chasers and a number of migrants from the pve server like myself (who got sick of a server where there is nothing to do except raid and BGs). Many then quit playing due to the unfortunate release of SoD and the negativity from individuals like yourself here and on discord - "these trolls who dont play on the server say it sucks, so it must suck".

That said though it would be good if the development team could give a headsup on their short term plans for the pvp server. It has an engaged community and lots of potential but we would appreciate some info on upcoming content release dates etc.

Even if it is as you say, what will you comment on the fact that the PvP server started with a population of ~5000 and now is down to ~300 and the tendency for it is to keep going down, while the PvE server's population has been stable at ~5000 ever since Chinese players were offloaded on their own designated servers?

Yes, I don't play on the PvP server, nor do I ever plan to make my life any more difficult by beginning to play there, but I don't hate the PvP, I had mixed feelings when a PvP server was announced, in a way I was unhappy that the population was being segregated, because one of Turtle WoW's original philosophies was to only have one server and keep it that way, on the other hand I was looking at it as a social experiment and I was curious to see how it will go, apparently it went in a way that the PvP population is dwindling.

As I said multiple times and hate to repeat myself anymore, I attribute this to people just losing interest and realizing that PvP isn't as fun as they originally thought it would be and as they leave, more people leave and the snowballing effect is now putting the PvP server's existence in danger.

If you have any other idea why the PvP server's population is dwindling, by all means let it be known. I seriously doubt Season of Discovery was the reason for the drop as the PvE server's population remained the same regardless. Season of Discovery also proved to be a disappointing and overhyped attempt to do something unique with WoW Classic.

I would also be interested to hear what you think would be the solution to revive the PvP server and bring people back. Because I'm not well versed in PvP, but from what I know as a PvE bystander, I can't think of any solution on how to remedy the PvP disaster. PvP in the long run proves to be a nuisance to deal with and people don't want to go back home from work and get killed in game that they are playing in hopes to relax. Retail WoW did something recently when they announced something like a Battle Royale. While it means nothing to me, a friend of mine plays Retail and he summarized it for me in a few sentences and the idea is not half bad, but I doubt Turtle WoW team will dedicate time and resources to reproduce something like this, even more so, this can serve for Turtle WoW haters as a ammunition to say "Turtle WoW copied Retail".

Something else has to be thought up, or call it quits.

[Bjorn88]

Even if it is as you say, what will you comment on the fact that the PvP server started with a population of ~5000 and now is down to ~300 and the tendency for it is to keep going down, while the PvE server's population has been stable at ~5000 ever since Chinese players were offloaded on their own designated servers?

Yes, I don't play on the PvP server, nor do I ever plan to make my life any more difficult by beginning to play there, but I don't hate the PvP, I had mixed feelings when a PvP server was announced, in a way I was unhappy that the population was being segregated, because one of Turtle WoW's original philosophies was to only have one server and keep it that way, on the other hand I was looking at it as a social experiment and I was curious to see how it will go, apparently it went in a way that the PvP population is dwindling.

As I said multiple times and hate to repeat myself anymore, I attribute this to people just losing interest and realizing that PvP isn't as fun as they originally thought it would be and as they leave, more people leave and the snowballing effect is now putting the PvP server's existence in danger.

If you have any other idea why the PvP server's population is dwindling, by all means let it be known. I seriously doubt Season of Discovery was the reason for the drop as the PvE server's population remained the same regardless. Season of Discovery also proved to be a disappointing and overhyped attempt to do something unique with WoW Classic.

I would also be interested to hear what you think would be the solution to revive the PvP server and bring people back. Because I'm not well versed in PvP, but from what I know as a PvE bystander, I can't think of any solution on how to remedy the PvP disaster. PvP in the long run proves to be a nuisance to deal with and people don't want to go back home from work and get killed in game that they are playing in hopes to relax. Retail WoW did something recently when they announced something like a Battle Royale. While it means nothing to me, a friend of mine plays Retail and he summarized it for me in a few sentences and the idea is not half bad, but I doubt Turtle WoW team will dedicate time and resources to reproduce something like this, even more so, this can serve for Turtle WoW haters as a ammunition to say "Turtle WoW copied Retail".

Something else has to be thought up, or call it quits.

It is completely natural that the pve server retained more players when SoD released since it has been around much longer - people were more invested in their characters/guilds. Tel'abim had been open for a month before it released.

You base your arguments on the impact of SoD on your own reflections/gut feeling with zero empirical proof.The correlation between SoD release and Tel'abim pop drop is quite evident. For my own part I saw my guildleader leave for SoD along with around 120 guildmembers quite soon after it released.

I must say it is quite nonchalant of people who don't do/like pvp or let alone play on Tel'abim to comment on what should be done with the server. Especially with an attitude like yours. Leave it to the players, please.

As for suggestions on how to improve the wpvp part of the server, I have made two threads with suggestions, one of them here: viewtopic.php?t=13320

[Noshu]

I think you're forgetting the tidbit where our friend here insinuated you were being rude. A pretty fair assessment, since one of your first conclusions to be made about a person was that they were in their 40s, lived in their mother's basement, and hadn't worked a day. Pretty heft stuff. Other hurtful things too, but hey- who's really counting?

Point is, I- and I assume everyone else who's spoken so far thinks it's not very christian of you going around and insulting people, then when your callous behavior is addressed you use your religion as some sort of excuse or reasoning for it. Or something along those lines? Eh, not sure. That's how it comes off to me.

Now that I think about it, wasn't talk of religions and other controversies banned here? Haven't you been on the server since 50 pop? Prolly should've picked up on that by now...

I haven't started any of that. I said PvP is dead, because people aren't interested in it. You are forgetting that my opinion triggered several people who then attacked me in all kinds of different ways. I wasn't the one who began suggesting who should "go outside" or talk about what profile pictures should be used or not.

Go back and read the posts above, in every of these situations you mention, I was provoked. I just stood my ground and now you are trying to demonize me for standing by my opinion that PvP is dead, because people aren't interested in it.

Look hard at yourself and the other people who obviously think they have a beef with me and see how you are twisting facts and trying to put words in my mouth to fit your narrative. This behavior is sociopathic and not normal. You can try to vilify me more if that floats your boat.

I will say it again - PvP is dead, because people aren't interested in it. There was a very loud and vocal minority who demanded to be given a PvP server. Turtle WoW team gave them a PvP server, said PvP server died, because people realized PvP isn't as fun as they thought and they also realized they are a minority. There is no way to revive and revitalize PvP, because people just don't want to do it. It's only a matter of time before the PvP server is shut down or merged back into the PvE server. Hate me all you want, you will see it happen in the near future.

I don't, I just find your personality extremely obnoxious.

Fantastic, carry on then.

TlDR since I'd rather not waste my time with this: Wrathful keyboard warrior goes on novel length tirade degrading a person for grammar mistakes, doles out insults and passive aggressive comments, and accuses naysayer of mental illness after one post they make because they also had a different take on the situation.

You sure you don't suffer from narcissism?

Haha yea, this is ridiculous. He might be trolling tbh

[Natuaduck]

Coming from Nostalrius, Elysium, and Warmane I can solidly say: No.

This is an ongoing argument that never goes anywhere because a handful of overly passionate "pvpers" jump in throwing insults and screaming and yelling about how "weak" and "pathetic" you have to be to not want pvp. Or how "if you're a red name you're free game".

Despite WPVP being great and competitive from time to time, the majority of the playerbase don't engage in it and rarely if ever have it happen.

The "wpvp" that ends up happening is a max level or two show up, they one shot low levels for ten minutes or so before "help is called". High levels may or may not even show up to help defend the low levels, at which case, the attacking high levels stay to fight or they leave.

[Noshu]

Coming from Nostalrius, Elysium, and Warmane I can solidly say: No.

This is an ongoing argument that never goes anywhere because a handful of overly passionate "pvpers" jump in throwing insults and screaming and yelling about how "weak" and "pathetic" you have to be to not want pvp. Or how "if you're a red name you're free game".

Despite WPVP being great and competitive from time to time, the majority of the playerbase don't engage in it and rarely if ever have it happen.

The "wpvp" that ends up happening is a max level or two show up, they one shot low levels for ten minutes or so before "help is called". High levels may or may not even show up to help defend the low levels, at which case, the attacking high levels stay to fight or they leave.

I think my suggestion would solve many of your worries though. I don't see how any low level player will be ganked in an end-game zone that is made for world pvp. They wont be flagged in any other zone, and if they for some reason choose to visit this zone, then maybe they should wait until they get to lvl 60. Nobody is forced to participate in this form of world pvp, unlike Nostalrius, Elysium or Warmane, where you're flagged in all contested zones.

This suggestion will concentrate all the players who wants to participate in world pvp in one zone, and you don't have to go there if you don't want to participate.

[Noshu]

Obviously, because you are just_another_clueless_guy this forum is full of. Literally posting about anything you have no clue.
Nostalrius forum is sitll active, you can crawl there and check my words (however you might find even more reasons to call that server a trashcan it was).

Same goes for your all other examples, i bet you have never played them too.

I see that I have made the mistake of engaging someone who smokes crack in their spare time. This forum is not unlike how you describe nostalrius with the likes of you posting.

Yes you surely made a mistake posting about servers you did not xperience.
Glad you have aknowledged it

So much salt in this thread

[Ataika]

I see that I have made the mistake of engaging someone who smokes crack in their spare time. This forum is not unlike how you describe nostalrius with the likes of you posting.

Yes you surely made a mistake posting about servers you did not xperience.
Glad you have aknowledged it

So much salt in this thread

salt is top #2 right after clueless people posts
you contribute hard

[Noshu]

fix pvp please

[Noshu]

Wtb world pvp zone

[Imonobor]

Noshu described an area other than Alterac Valley. He, like myself, like to have a zone where you can sneak in with the hope of finding wealth while risking being thrashed. This is a series of gambling. Excitement. Give us that!

To build on this idea, how about we make the zone high-risk? Cram it full of gatherables like mining nodes, herbs, chests, mobs with great drops, rare elites etc. However, you can only enter or exit the zone from your faction's camp, and the farther you get from the camp, the more riches you find.

However, dying makes you drop gold and/or BoE items you've gathered since entering.

Also being able to declare yourself a mercenary and attack your own faction members would be the cherry ontop. However, you won't be able to exit the zone via your faction base, you'd gave to go to a dangerous lawless neutral town that doesn't have guards to catch your ship off the island.

Also for obvious reasons portable banks, auctioneers, mailboxes, BG queues, hearthstones, portals, summons, etc would be forbidden on the island. Logout timer on the island is also going to be 1 minute instead of 20 seconds.

[Deeno]

TLDR: ppl want Timeless Isle from Pandaria

[Noshu]

Noshu described an area other than Alterac Valley. He, like myself, like to have a zone where you can sneak in with the hope of finding wealth while risking being thrashed. This is a series of gambling. Excitement. Give us that!

To build on this idea, how about we make the zone high-risk? Cram it full of gatherables like mining nodes, herbs, chests, mobs with great drops, rare elites etc. However, you can only enter or exit the zone from your faction's camp, and the farther you get from the camp, the more riches you find.

However, dying makes you drop gold and/or BoE items you've gathered since entering.

Also being able to declare yourself a mercenary and attack your own faction members would be the cherry ontop. However, you won't be able to exit the zone via your faction base, you'd gave to go to a dangerous lawless neutral town that doesn't have guards to catch your ship off the island.

Also for obvious reasons portable banks, auctioneers, mailboxes, BG queues, hearthstones, portals, summons, etc would be forbidden on the island. Logout timer on the island is also going to be 1 minute instead of 20 seconds.

I like this idea, and sounds very similar to what ascension has. However for turtle I'd like to just have somewhere to pvp to begin with. The idea is great though, and I love HR on ascension, but Idk if the average turtle wow pvp-er would enjoy high risk.

[Erhog]

Except that alterac valley is horrible and is not world pvp

So it's very important for you that your opponents should espawn at Spirit Healer and move to the corpse instead of just every 30 cd GY respawn? What does it change?

[Imonobor]

I like this idea, and sounds very similar to what ascension has. However for turtle I'd like to just have somewhere to pvp to begin with. The idea is great though, and I love HR on ascension, but Idk if the average turtle wow pvp-er would enjoy high risk.

I did try to tone down the odds, since you won't be dropping your gear like on Ascension, nor enormous amounts of gold if you want to protect your gear. I was thinking in the ballpark of 3-5 gold per death to spice things up, but not make people too afraid to go there. If you have valuable BoE items like gatherables, you drop them instead of the gold.

I think it's worth the experiment, since if there is an actual reason for PvE-ers to go there (the resources), it will create a WPvP feeling when PvPers go there to hunt them down. Also I am usually a PvE-er myself, and some of the best moments in WoW I've had were in high risk PvP, so you never know what people might like. A little risk can go a long way.

PvP objectives, random recurring events like cache drops, invasions, faction patrols and skirmishes, nodes, etc, and base sieges would further flesh out the zone and make it more attractive.

[Gantulga]

With the upcoming class changes, WPvP may get a chance. Although warmode should also be fixed to protect you from bluewalling and such.

[Calli]

we do bro! enjoy!

Says video unavailable

Well done guys. Actually people who are DOING the thing, not complaining about it (I firmly believe many ppl write on this forum have no idea about the topic they contribute to). They doing it for fun, not just rewards, gear, etc, just having a good time. Respect!

[Calli]

But yeah, 80-90% of server pop don't like pvp but pve. A new pvp dedicated zone won't change that. They come here for pve content and doing hc, inferno challenge. PVP you can play in many places it does not attract enough ppl. Even on tel abim most of the ppl are waiting for the opening of AQ40.

[Ataika]

we do bro! enjoy!

Says video unavailable

Well done guys. Actually people who are DOING the thing, not complaining about it (I firmly believe many ppl write on this forum have no idea about the topic they contribute to). They doing it for fun, not just rewards, gear, etc, just having a good time. Respect!

fun fact they are not doing it anymore due to server being dead
sadly your respect does not bring online up

and class changes are so far ahead you might consider your pension first

[Calli]

Says video unavailable

Well done guys. Actually people who are DOING the thing, not complaining about it (I firmly believe many ppl write on this forum have no idea about the topic they contribute to). They doing it for fun, not just rewards, gear, etc, just having a good time. Respect!

fun fact they are not doing it anymore due to server being dead
sadly your respect does not bring online up

and class changes are so far ahead you might consider your pension first

I wonder how many ppl will cry when class changes 2 comes out. Mark my words.

[Ataika]

Well done guys. Actually people who are DOING the thing, not complaining about it (I firmly believe many ppl write on this forum have no idea about the topic they contribute to). They doing it for fun, not just rewards, gear, etc, just having a good time. Respect!

fun fact they are not doing it anymore due to server being dead
sadly your respect does not bring online up

and class changes are so far ahead you might consider your pension first

I wonder how many ppl will cry when class changes 2 comes out. Mark my words.

Its inevitable, because no1 knows what changes it will be
I have no doubts some changes will be drastical

[Imonobor]

Even if it's the best, most thought-out and balanced update ever (which is impossible), people will ALWAYS find something to whine and bitch about, they are experts at that. It's just human nature to have an aversion to change.
That being said, I'm super hyped for it.

[Noshu]

fun fact they are not doing it anymore due to server being dead
sadly your respect does not bring online up

and class changes are so far ahead you might consider your pension first

I wonder how many ppl will cry when class changes 2 comes out. Mark my words.

Its inevitable, because no1 knows what changes it will be
I have no doubts some changes will be drastical

yep, hopefully the meta wont change all too much

[Geojak]

you cant have good world pvp on a crossfacrtion server without crossfaction pvp.
as long a 1 guy can gank a mixed group and only half of the attacked group can respond, the sitatuion is screwed.
as long as one raid competing with another for a world boss can only compete with half of the other raid team respectively, the sitaution is doomed.
now good world pvp will ever come from this.
booty bay and rachet manage to handle criminials well. why cant we have this for storwmind. let me attack anyone that is pvp flagged no matter what faction
yu should only get honour poins for enemy faction players.

[Noshu]

you cant have good world pvp on a crossfacrtion server without crossfaction pvp.
as long a 1 guy can gank a mixed group and only half of the attacked group can respond, the sitatuion is screwed.
as long as one raid competing with another for a world boss can only compete with half of the other raid team respectively, the sitaution is doomed.
now good world pvp will ever come from this.
booty bay and rachet manage to handle criminials well. why cant we have this for storwmind. let me attack anyone that is pvp flagged no matter what faction
yu should only get honour poins for enemy faction players.

the crossfaction issue could be solved by free for all flagging a group or raid, if 1 or more people are pvp flagged, in that way any1 can attack the group

or just disable cross faction grouping in that zone

[Neltharion]

This kind of update should be Tel'abim only
Nordanaar can keep its funserver gylphs/challenges.