Undead Paladins, Dwarf Shamans

[Dracarusggotham]

Please Turtle WoW Team:
NEVER do this, keep that two classes as special classes for their factions, never ruin that special and exclusive feeling for each faction.
And people, stop asking for that, I hope it never happen.
If you want a Paladin, join the Alliance.
If you want a Shaman, join the Horde.
As simple at it is now.

[Xfraz]

Und PALA / Dwarf Shaman WHEN?

[Wafflecrusher]

Agreed. Turtle would really lose the classic+ feel if they did something like that.

[Darktifa]

For the Original PvE Turtle Realm, certainly it would be bad
For the new PvP Realm, it might be a good idea

[Ashstache]

You can't stop what's coming.

[Charanko]

But why? Why not leave a little faction specific identity? Its what made vanilla feel vanilla?

[Slashignore]

Und PALA / Dwarf Shaman WHEN?

[Kefke]

Und PALA / Dwarf Shaman WHEN?

[Tacticalnelf]

Und PALA / Dwarf Shaman WHEN?

[Sylveria]

Please Turtle WoW Team:
NEVER do this, keep that two classes as special classes for their factions, never ruin that special and exclusive feeling for each faction.
And people, stop asking for that, I hope it never happen.
If you want a Paladin, join the Alliance.
If you want a Shaman, join the Horde.
As simple at it is now.

100% Agree

You can't stop what's coming.

So you want Dwarfes with elvish ears? :P

[Ashstache]

Please Turtle WoW Team:
NEVER do this, keep that two classes as special classes for their factions, never ruin that special and exclusive feeling for each faction.
And people, stop asking for that, I hope it never happen.
If you want a Paladin, join the Alliance.
If you want a Shaman, join the Horde.
As simple at it is now.

100% Agree

You can't stop what's coming.

So you want Dwarfes with elvish ears? :P

There were a few better ones lol

[Geojak]

Undead shaman when

[Geojak]

It will happen, Just like pvp fresh happened. It's the only way to keep crossfaction pve servers consistent in balance with pvp servers.

And this nonsense about this vanilla spirit is garbo. This is classic+ and their is nothing to gain from faction split

[Wrathweaver]

Please Turtle WoW Team:
NEVER do this, keep that two classes as special classes for their factions, never ruin that special and exclusive feeling for each faction.
And people, stop asking for that, I hope it never happen.
If you want a Paladin, join the Alliance.
If you want a Shaman, join the Horde.
As simple at it is now.

100% Agree

You can't stop what's coming.

So you want Dwarfes with elvish ears? :P

There were a few better ones lol

Even a dwarf shaman now!

Got any more of these pictures, this is really good lol :D
Edit: Shaman and Paladin should be faction exclusive for the record:P

[Sylveria]

looks now more like a death knight, than a paladin.
But I'd be fine with a deathknight (lite) as a dark-mirror for the paladin on horde-side.
or a necrolyte:
Deathknight-esk for Ret/Prot spec
and a Shadowy Heal for the holy spec.

[Wrathweaver]

looks now more like a death knight, than a paladin.
But I'd be fine with a deathknight (lite) as a dark-mirror for the paladin on horde-side.
or a necrolyte:
Deathknight-esk for Ret/Prot spec
and a Shadowy Heal for the holy spec.

Remember dreaming of a WC3 style Death Knight with Mana when they where first announced DK in Retail.
Playing like a Dark Version of Paladin for Horde, although different in many aspects.

Can imagine how Disapointed i was when they announced the Rune/Runic power system.

[Dracarusggotham]

It will happen, Just like pvp fresh happened. It's the only way to keep crossfaction pve servers consistent in balance with pvp servers.

And this nonsense about this vanilla spirit is garbo. This is classic+ and their is nothing to gain from faction split

No, the idea of Turtle WoW is be a vanilla+, a damn VANILLA+.
Clearly they change things, but the Classic mechanics needs to stay like them are, instead that can be annoying, like Honor System.
They are building the story over the Warcraft 3 lore, and the undead can't be Paladins cause the Sacred Light is mortal for them, and you ignore the basics for be a Paladin, they need to be good, have good intentions and hug the Light Blessing and have faith in it. The undead are not good, don't have good intentions and clearly don't have faith in the light.
I can't imagine a shadow paladin or a dark paladin.
They can make the shaman better instead use that fast way to put the Paladins in the Horde without a good reason more than the PvP.
And you forget one thing, THIS IS A DAMN PvE server, not PvP, if you want PvP go to other server, here the Turtle WoW team centers on the lore over the PvP, here we are to see a good story, not the fcking boring PvP, if you don't understand it, you don't have nothing to do here.
So, Paladins don't have nothing to do and don't have a good reason to be a Horde Class, and at the same time, the Dwarfs don't have a reason to became Shamans.

[Bob022]

Absolutely nothing about Dwarves seems shamanistic; they're far too advanced a society. None of the Alliances races are good fits for the Shaman. Night Elves probably come closest, but even that's a stretch given their fairly advanced society. Shamans are always portrayed as originating from fairly primitive, usually tribal or clannish cultures. That fits for the Orcs, Trolls, and Taurens, not so much for any of the other playable options.

I don't like the notion of undead paladins (they should be death-knights!), but since undead priests exist and retain all their Holy abilities in-game, I can't really argue against Paladins for them as well. They had them in life and apparently they retain their abilities in (un)death. The main argument against their inclusion becomes faction balance (since Shaman is a difficult sell for the Alliance) and preservation of WoW tradition.

How have the two classes co-existing in guild-scale settings affected group/raid balance? If it's been a positive effect, then some effort should be made to add them to the respective factions. If the impact has been more negative, then perhaps it's best to leave well enough alone for a fresh server.

[Hyrag]

100% Agree



So you want Dwarfes with elvish ears? :P

There were a few better ones lol

Even a dwarf shaman now!

Got any more of these pictures, this is really good lol :D
Edit: Shaman and Paladin should be faction exclusive for the record:P

Hey guys listen: Undead Death Knight(just a paladin skin tho)/ Dwarf Shaman...
When?

[Kefke]

So...weird idea. Horde gets Death Knight as an alt to Paladin. Alliance gets Runemaster as an alt to Shaman.

[Slashignore]

orc priest when kek

[Sylveria]

So...weird idea. Horde gets Death Knight as an alt to Paladin. Alliance gets Runemaster as an alt to Shaman.

Can get behind this one. Those classes just have some specific styles, that just don't fit with the other faction.
Might also bring up the whole topic again, that the holy light's actual harmful to undead. from pure logic, that's been implemented since WarCraft II, Undead Priests wouldn't have Holy/Disc Spec at all, but only shadow. Obviously for balancing reasons y'can't do that, since Horde would only have 1 race with a healing priest at all.. though i'm not so sure about Troll priests either, if they'd be able to evoke holy magic. Regarding their culture they'd be mainly shadow as well.. i think. And (obviously) you can't have two classes that are alliance only, while Horde only has one exclusive class (the shaman). So having holy magic on Horde side (especially with the undead) was mainly because of balancing reasons. So I think Blizz started retconning stuff there already.
(And whoever brings up this dude in Naxx... has it ever been explained, why he's still able to wield holy magic? Reasonably? Not just like "yeah it's like that. Deal with it."?)

Runemaster for dwarfs seem like a good alternative for shamans on alliance side. I don't have quite the idea 'bout the lore yet, but.. i can dig it. :)

[Jstansberry]

On a PvE server with crossfaction (now even for BGs - though in a limited state)I really don't think "faction identity" or other common reasons for faction exclusive classes apply at all. We already all benefit from both shaman and paladin buffs in raids.

For the upcoming PvP server, I'd understand why this would not be done.

Some people seem to have the opposite thinking, that it's more appropriate to have no faction restriction for shaman/paladin for balance, but I think the asymmetry is more important on a PvP server with no crossfaction because it actually matters there.

[Sylveria]

On a PvE server with crossfaction (now even for BGs - though in a limited state)I really don't think "faction identity" or other common reasons for faction exclusive classes apply at all. We already all benefit from both shaman and paladin buffs in raids.

That would be a statement though, that's kinda against the core of TWoW, which STILL is a RP(!)-PvE-Server and takes great care about the story and the authenticity of the world. Even though Horde and Alliance work together at points (shown here in the crossfaction gameplay), some things should stay in their respective faction.
Giving Horde Paladins "just for the heck of it" would be something a Fun-Server would do. (Note: For me a "Fun-Server" would be a server that just does all kinds of stuff regardless of Story and/or Authenticity. Kinda like playable Murlocs, what some servers do.) But Turtle isn't a Fun-Server, but an Rp-PvE-Server. And that was one of my top-reasons why i joined TWoW 1.5years ago. TWoW should stay primary to RP, secondary to PvE and tertiary to everything else when it comes to adding content and new stuff in general.

For the upcoming PvP server, I'd understand why this would not be done.

Some people seem to have the opposite thinking, that it's more appropriate to have no faction restriction for shaman/paladin for balance, but I think the asymmetry is more important on a PvP server with no crossfaction because it actually matters there.

Since i'm not really interested in PvP, i won't go much into that topic, but i see and agree with your reason, that the asymmetry makes the choice of faction matters.

[Twinking]

Und PALA / Dwarf Shaman WHEN?

[Zulnam]

Tauren warlock when?

[Dracarusggotham]

On a PvE server with crossfaction (now even for BGs - though in a limited state)I really don't think "faction identity" or other common reasons for faction exclusive classes apply at all. We already all benefit from both shaman and paladin buffs in raids.

That would be a statement though, that's kinda against the core of TWoW, which STILL is a RP(!)-PvE-Server and takes great care about the story and the authenticity of the world. Even though Horde and Alliance work together at points (shown here in the crossfaction gameplay), some things should stay in their respective faction.
Giving Horde Paladins "just for the heck of it" would be something a Fun-Server would do. (Note: For me a "Fun-Server" would be a server that just does all kinds of stuff regardless of Story and/or Authenticity. Kinda like playable Murlocs, what some servers do.) But Turtle isn't a Fun-Server, but an Rp-PvE-Server. And that was one of my top-reasons why i joined TWoW 1.5years ago. TWoW should stay primary to RP, secondary to PvE and tertiary to everything else when it comes to adding content and new stuff in general.

For the upcoming PvP server, I'd understand why this would not be done.

Some people seem to have the opposite thinking, that it's more appropriate to have no faction restriction for shaman/paladin for balance, but I think the asymmetry is more important on a PvP server with no crossfaction because it actually matters there.

Since i'm not really interested in PvP, i won't go much into that topic, but i see and agree with your reason, that the asymmetry makes the choice of faction matters.

That's my point and I agree with this 100%, TWoW is an RP-PvE server, that's the reason for the whole story they made with each patch, each race has its own story.
And a lot of people here ignore one thing, even Blizz in retail needed to add the Blood Elves to the Horde to allow them to have the Paladins, because if undead paladins for some reason fit into the lore I'm sure they would have done it a long time ago time instead of the throwback that was the Blood Elves in the Horde and the TERRIBLE MISTAKE that were the Draenei aka Space Goats.
It seems better to me that they improve the shaman to put him next to the paladin instead of forcing the paladin into the horde for no reason, thus TWoW would begin its decline.

[Bob022]

T-wow is not beholden to what Blizzard did or did not do. That being said, horde wasn't given Blood Elves because of paladins. Horde got Blood Elves because it turned out housewives didn't want to play ugly hunchbacks, contributing to a significant population imbalance between the factions throughout the pre-expansion era.

Paladins are a mess and a balance nightmare largely because Blizzard couldn't settle on a purpose for the class. In alpha they were meant to be tanks primarily, later on they were shifted to a healer/support class, later still shifting back to being able to that plus the tank and offense roles. As T-wow finds, trying to make it good at one of those tends to cascade into making it OP at one of the others due to ability interaction/synergy and the law of unintended consequences. Far as I'm concerned the class probably needs a complete overhaul, but that wouldn't be "classic" and probably falls outside T-wow's scope.

[Imonobor]

Undead Pala / Dwarf Shaman WHEN?!

[Dannyp92]

Paladins being ressurrected as Undead would become Death Knights (Undead get Death Knights)?
Dwarves could their own class Mountain King or Thane, which is a mix of Warrior and Shaman-abilities, without making them complete Shamans to keep the faction identities?

[Alfonso]

Ever asked your self why vanilla is popular?

Undead Pala / Dwarf Shaman would be the first step to killing twow.

Something like that would be a clear sign that the devs are idiots.
we would end like wow did as a mess of
"everyone got what he asked for now noone is happy"

Here are some more ideas from that corner:
- remove all capitals we only need Stormwind
- remove all flight paths and give us instant travel
- add instant revive from shaman to every race
- no more mounts just 200% walk speed

It triggers me that they don't add something to the game that makes raids and open worlds more challenging.

The game's development should be "deeper" not "broader".

Tune simple and boring mechanics. You should copy those additions from TBC that add to underrated skill choices.

A bad omen

[Ingameacc12345]

I say introduce UNDEAD DWARFS and SHAMAN PALADINS.

[Alfonso]

That turtle in the back should get changed to the face of Bobby

Big News: We added sparkling unicorns now come and play!

Noone cares when we tune retri pala / enhancer so it feels more even.

Just put more on top of the pile of "When you buy our product you get a free pencil and that door stopper that looks like a turtle and a firework and 3days free parking"

---- End of Marketing / Start of Quality ----

If you are that bored maybe tune:
BM Hunter
Subtlety Rogue
Arcane Mage

There is more just look through the forums

[Galindae]

Undead papladins are possible same as death knights . In lore first death knights where created by orc shaman trough fel force. Think he was Kel thuzad who later used arthas .....
Dwarf can't be shaman because of nature magic . Shamans use spirits and elemental magic. It's different from mage or priest magic using
Undead priests using holy magic. Noone has question here,? But are against undead paladins who would basically use Holly magic but just wear plate.
P.s undead players are marked as humans not undead Vs NPC undead. Because they are not controlled by scourge . It's mean undead paladins has bigger chance to happen than dawi shamans. From lore offc.

[Ashstache]

Dwarf can't be shaman because of nature magic . Shamans use spirits and elemental magic. It's different from mage or priest magic using

bro has never heard of Wildhammer dwarves