Turtle WoW

.....

Jkldsngkljsng wrote: ↑

Thu Apr 04, 2024 9:18 pm

Akalix does not cut it, he largely killed the scene.

how so ?

Ataika wrote: ↑

Thu Apr 04, 2024 8:30 pm

We are talking about a smol team that made sunnyglade walley.
While the bg itself is quite boring the factsshows twow team's capability to make completely new battlegrounds with unique mechanics (when they want)

Yes, but precisely, this brand new BG must have required a lot of effort and seeing that nobody plays it, I think it doesn't motivate them to try the experience again. They can create new PvP stuff, but from their perspective (with limited resources), it might not be "profitable" (unfortunately).

But there may be smaller things to try out, like adding variety to existing BGs - random weather conditions, time-limited bonuses for certain classes, I don't know... but basically anything to make each BG, even existing ones, slightly different from the last.

And obviously put an end to the horrible ranking system of Vanilla, which is pretty discouraging in itself.

In the long run, it would also be necessary for 100% PvP guilds to form and specialize, but for that, there needs to be stakes and more structured competition (e.g., rated BGs, with seasons, etc.)

100% PvP guilds should be the driving force of the entire PvP ecosystem, just as the big PvE guilds are for the other aspect of the game.

Any kind of PvP-related changes will be fruitless until the horrendous class balance that twow introduced is dealt with.

Of course the pvp situation on the main server is abysmal, you all asked for a pvp server and migrated to it, leaving only the pve players behind. And now the population on the pvp server has dried up or left for greener pastures (sod or whatever). Launching a pvp server and splitting the western community must have been one of TWoW’s bigger mistakes. Players told them that the western playerbase was not large enough and that there was enough room on the main server following the deployment of the asian servers.

and now the players that don't want a merge are just there for the pve

Thecakeisalie wrote: ↑

Thu Apr 04, 2024 11:05 pm

Of course the pvp situation on the main server is abysmal, you all asked for a pvp server and migrated to it, leaving only the pve players behind. And now the population on the pvp server has dried up or left for greener pastures (sod or whatever). Launching a pvp server and splitting the western community must have been one of TWoW’s bigger mistakes. Players told them that the western playerbase was not large enough and that there was enough room on the main server following the deployment of the asian servers.

I was playing during these split server times and main one server was perfectly ok pvp wise, at least battlegrounds were poppin left and right. So its surely not the split.

Ataika wrote: ↑

Fri Apr 05, 2024 7:05 am

I was playing during these split server times and main one server was perfectly ok pvp wise, at least battlegrounds were poppin left and right. So its surely not the split.

If you mean recent change in pvp situation, then there should be other reasons. Class balance in current state exists for long time. Honor system exists for 20(?) years.
My guess about recent Nordnaar PvP situation is that punishing AFK players become more harsh. Thats why a lot of casual players decided that they don't have chances to get any good gear.

Ataika wrote: ↑

Fri Apr 05, 2024 7:05 am

Thecakeisalie wrote: ↑

Thu Apr 04, 2024 11:05 pm

Of course the pvp situation on the main server is abysmal, you all asked for a pvp server and migrated to it, leaving only the pve players behind. And now the population on the pvp server has dried up or left for greener pastures (sod or whatever). Launching a pvp server and splitting the western community must have been one of TWoW’s bigger mistakes. Players told them that the western playerbase was not large enough and that there was enough room on the main server following the deployment of the asian servers.

I was playing during these split server times and main one server was perfectly ok pvp wise, at least battlegrounds were poppin left and right. So its surely not the split.

Last years population boom was never going to last, I would guess a large majority were actually Chinese players that later migrated and the launch of SOD didn’t help either. The playerbase on Tel’Abim was also fine at launch but look at it now.

Nitaya wrote: ↑

Thu Apr 04, 2024 4:28 pm

But is there any proper reward, even for winning?

...Assume you start PvP at lvl 60, you won't see a proper reward in the 1st few weeks.

Compare it with PvE, you go to MC / ZG / AQ20 / Kara / Ony as fresh lvl 60. You spend around 6 hours for that activity / week.
In 2-3 weeks you will be in decent gear, afterwards you can shift to BWL / ES / AQ40.
...

1000%; about the multi-teams battleroyal I recognize it has the potential to revitalize the PvP scene but for sure some kind of shake in PvP is needed (and it can't be the classes changes update).

.....

While I don't do PvP, and I only play Alliance, I think the best way to improve the situation in aay and shut the Horde players whining about Paladin being too OP in PvP is to create a counter for the Paladin and the best candidate for that is the Shaman.

Give the Shaman a set of abilities that counter everything the Paladin does and when the Paladin is nullified, then at least this aspect of PvP is fixed.

It also enforced the faction identity of both Paladin and Shaman.

As for the main problem why people don't want to play PvP and bother with it, nobody can fix that.

PvP is as good as dead.

good sound for an happy pvp

Typh1 wrote: ↑

Thu Apr 04, 2024 7:28 am

Don't like pvp? don't play mmo in general, go play The Sims.

heh isnt most of wow players are pvers?

@Something@ my thouts about this somthing, make pvp non factional and profitable so ppl will play it to get some golds/reagents/etc for theyr mounts and raids and whatewer needs they have coz pvp for pvp seems dosent realy work
also make talent change for bgs coz its an headache to have mulityfunctional spec whats work in both ways good

Glipo wrote: ↑

Sun Apr 07, 2024 3:08 pm

Typh1 wrote: ↑

Thu Apr 04, 2024 7:28 am

Don't like pvp? don't play mmo in general, go play The Sims.

heh isnt most of wow players are pvers?

That is not correct. The only reason I can imagine why you would want PVE is you are a chinese goldfarmer who has zero skill and plays the game for monetary purpose.

If they just put pvp gear in the game that wasn't ridiculous to acquire and made it so it couldn't be used in raids as not to effect the precious raid progress there would be more people in this gear than raid gear. The server would blow up and there would be tons of pvp but they will never do this because the people running the server would rather 500 ppl dedicated to raiding than 5k who mostly dont care about it.

This is facts

Typh1 wrote: ↑

Wed Apr 10, 2024 4:44 am

Glipo wrote: ↑

Sun Apr 07, 2024 3:08 pm

heh isnt most of wow players are pvers?

That is not correct.

Judging by the numbers I'd say that's very much correct:

Ingameacc12345 wrote: ↑

Wed Apr 10, 2024 7:17 am

Judging by the numbers I'd say that's very much correct:

There are many factors that explain this situation, and most of them have nothing to do with whether the servers are "PvE/PvP."

Moreover, there isn't much PvP-specific features on the PvP server, hence the continuous loss of players. It's just an underpopulated PvE server (with far fewer Chinese farmers).

Ragetto wrote: ↑

Wed Apr 10, 2024 7:27 am

Ingameacc12345 wrote: ↑

Wed Apr 10, 2024 7:17 am

Judging by the numbers I'd say that's very much correct:

There are many factors that explain this situation, and most of them have nothing to do with whether the servers are "PvE/PvP."

Moreover, there isn't much PvP-specific features on the PvP server, hence the continuous loss of players. It's just an underpopulated PvE server (with far fewer Chinese farmers).

I'm aware of what you said, it just always frustrates me to see people stating with full confidence that most players are PvPers while numbers CLEARLY show that PvP server has order of magnitude players less than PvE one.

Ingameacc12345 wrote: ↑

Wed Apr 10, 2024 9:36 am

Ragetto wrote: ↑

Wed Apr 10, 2024 7:27 am

Ingameacc12345 wrote: ↑

Wed Apr 10, 2024 7:17 am

Judging by the numbers I'd say that's very much correct:

There are many factors that explain this situation, and most of them have nothing to do with whether the servers are "PvE/PvP."

Moreover, there isn't much PvP-specific features on the PvP server, hence the continuous loss of players. It's just an underpopulated PvE server (with far fewer Chinese farmers).

I'm aware of what you said, it just always frustrates me to see people stating with full confidence that most players are PvPers while numbers CLEARLY show that PvP server has order of magnitude players less than PvE one.

Twow players are certainly not representative of wow players as a whole. In classic the pvp servers were by far more populated (pve servers seen as kind of niche). If anything, twow pop is skewered towards the minority who likes to only pve and rp, which is natural given the purposes of the project.

Ingameacc12345 wrote: ↑

Wed Apr 10, 2024 9:36 am

I'm aware of what you said, it just always frustrates me to see people stating with full confidence that most players are PvPers while numbers CLEARLY show that PvP server has order of magnitude players less than PvE one.

Most players are PvPers, they just don't play Turtle.
Even total 3k is much mush less than potential amount of players who could play here, but they don't.

Xudo wrote: ↑

Wed Apr 10, 2024 9:45 am

Ingameacc12345 wrote: ↑

Wed Apr 10, 2024 9:36 am

I'm aware of what you said, it just always frustrates me to see people stating with full confidence that most players are PvPers while numbers CLEARLY show that PvP server has order of magnitude players less than PvE one.

Most players are PvPers, they just don't play Turtle.
Even total 3k is much mush less than potential amount of players who could play here, but they don't.

I see that you still don't understand me.

I say: Most players are PvErs, giving you proof.
You say: Most players are PvPers, without any proof.

Ingameacc12345 wrote: ↑

Wed Apr 10, 2024 1:09 pm

Xudo wrote: ↑

Wed Apr 10, 2024 9:45 am

Ingameacc12345 wrote: ↑

Wed Apr 10, 2024 9:36 am

I'm aware of what you said, it just always frustrates me to see people stating with full confidence that most players are PvPers while numbers CLEARLY show that PvP server has order of magnitude players less than PvE one.

Most players are PvPers, they just don't play Turtle.
Even total 3k is much mush less than potential amount of players who could play here, but they don't.

I see that you still don't understand me.

I say: Most players are PvErs, giving you proof.
You say: Most players are PvPers, without any proof.

https://www.wowhead.com/classic/news/cl ... ity-295075

Server population data from Classic 2019, around two-three weeks after release.

US: PVP servers had >2x population of PVE (Normal) servers.
EU: PVP servers had >3x population of PVE (Normal) servers.

Now can you please accept that most wow players have preferred playing on a pvp server.

indeed

Bjorn88 wrote: ↑

Wed Apr 10, 2024 1:32 pm

Ingameacc12345 wrote: ↑

Wed Apr 10, 2024 1:09 pm

Xudo wrote: ↑

Wed Apr 10, 2024 9:45 am

Most players are PvPers, they just don't play Turtle.
Even total 3k is much mush less than potential amount of players who could play here, but they don't.

I see that you still don't understand me.

I say: Most players are PvErs, giving you proof.
You say: Most players are PvPers, without any proof.

https://www.wowhead.com/classic/news/cl ... ity-295075

Server population data from Classic 2019, around two-three weeks after release.

US: PVP servers had >2x population of PVE (Normal) servers.
EU: PVP servers had >3x population of PVE (Normal) servers.

Now can you please accept that most wow players have preferred playing on a pvp server.

Thanks, but you yourself just said: Twow players are certainly not representative of wow players as a whole.

So what it is actually? Can we or can we not apply same measures to Twow players as to classic players?

And if "Most players are PvPers, they just don't play Turtle." then this discussion is moot because we are on Turtle forums.

Twow are no exception of any other wow classic player. RP is super gay and PvE stands for the biggest circlejerk you can imagine. Don't like to be ganked? Then don't play mmo. Consider Spinoza's law of the strongest.

Ingameacc12345 wrote: ↑

Wed Apr 10, 2024 1:59 pm

Bjorn88 wrote: ↑

Wed Apr 10, 2024 1:32 pm

Ingameacc12345 wrote: ↑

Wed Apr 10, 2024 1:09 pm

I see that you still don't understand me.

I say: Most players are PvErs, giving you proof.
You say: Most players are PvPers, without any proof.

https://www.wowhead.com/classic/news/cl ... ity-295075

Server population data from Classic 2019, around two-three weeks after release.

US: PVP servers had >2x population of PVE (Normal) servers.
EU: PVP servers had >3x population of PVE (Normal) servers.

Now can you please accept that most wow players have preferred playing on a pvp server.

Thanks, but you yourself just said: Twow players are certainly not representative of wow players as a whole.

So what it is actually? Can we or can we not apply same measures to Twow players as to classic players?

And if "Most players are PvPers, they just don't play Turtle." then this discussion is moot because we are on Turtle forums.

^this. Turtle WoW used to be a Roleplay-PvE-Server. I'd be glad if Turtle-Team would be a bit more strict on Rp-Rules again for this server.

Ingameacc12345 wrote: ↑

Wed Apr 10, 2024 1:59 pm

Bjorn88 wrote: ↑

Wed Apr 10, 2024 1:32 pm

Ingameacc12345 wrote: ↑

Wed Apr 10, 2024 1:09 pm

I see that you still don't understand me.

I say: Most players are PvErs, giving you proof.
You say: Most players are PvPers, without any proof.

https://www.wowhead.com/classic/news/cl ... ity-295075

Server population data from Classic 2019, around two-three weeks after release.

US: PVP servers had >2x population of PVE (Normal) servers.
EU: PVP servers had >3x population of PVE (Normal) servers.

Now can you please accept that most wow players have preferred playing on a pvp server.

Thanks, but you yourself just said: Twow players are certainly not representative of wow players as a whole.

So what it is actually? Can we or can we not apply same measures to Twow players as to classic players?

And if "Most players are PvPers, they just don't play Turtle." then this discussion is moot because we are on Turtle forums.

You started this debate, now the numbers prove you wrong by a margin, poor way of trying to squirm out of it.

Twow with its focus on pve and rp is a niche project in the overall WoW community of players/servers. Nothing wrong with that, it just is. The consequence is naturally that it attracts players who are are predominantly interested in pve and rp, thus making the server pop not representative of the typical preferences of wow players. Therefore, the difference in server pop between Nordanaar and Tel'abim does not reflect the preferences of the overall number of WoW players worldwide (or atleast, the EU and US which I provided numbers for).

The majority of wow players, as I have now shown you with numbers, have prefered to play on a pvp server.

The majority of wow players, as I have now shown you with numbers, have prefered to play on a pvp server.

Exactly this

People seem to forget that Nordanaar is a RP-PvE-PvP-HC realm. The PvP part is covered by the optional War Mode which did attract many new players.

The scene is dead

Imonobor wrote: ↑

Thu Apr 04, 2024 6:09 am

Glyphs should help. Class changes might as well. But most of all, that PvP update they have on their roadmap about the pvp gearing overhaul, ranking overhaul, and pvp world objectives. If those don't help we might as well give up hope, but for now there IS hope.

These all will help a lot.

Main things imo that would help. Just ideas.

1. PvP gear and upgrades being able to be obtained slowly through makes of honor
2. BG only consumes (lip,fap, major healing potion, ect.) that you can buy through marks of honor
3. Class changes that are coming
4. Donate option for PvP dev salary
5. Make baseline pvp gear really fast to obtain and super good pvp gear non usable in raids as well as a very long grind so AFKers have no reason to join besides for maybe a little bit (also helps out fresh 60s)
6. Pvp gear bonuses that are super good but only impact PvP such as +50 all resist from WSG two piece in bgs only
7. Xfaction
8. Hidden titles for being a bamofo slaying other toons or capping flags, ect
9. Taking insignia is now an item you can keep (like Diablo 2 ears) to prove you killed that T4 druid after failing 50x

1&2 above allow people to continue to be rewarded even after max rep/honor

10. Daily quests that are objective or hk based