Oppose the cancellation of Chinese support

[Azuladrip]

Do you feel like a "cockroach" now?

I said my piece.

Cockroaches can speak their mind too
Nobody cares
They get stepped over!

There are things I'd say as a fellow Balkanite that unfortunately I can't due to the rules. So all I'll say is this: ;).

[Geojak]

Turtle WoW is committed to fostering an inclusive and diverse community where people from all nations and backgrounds can come together to enjoy the game. We want to clarify that we hold no discriminatory views towards any nation or group.

Our primary goal is to provide the best possible experience for all our players, ensuring a friendly and welcoming environment.

I will discuss potential exceptions for the Hanzi character support on our existing realm at the next senior team meeting, but I can't promise anything at this point.

Please, dont.

What op and many others appear to be missing is that it's not purely about chinese spam in public channels. That's already against the tos.

The much more pressing thing is that we have a segregated community. Those who speak english and those who dont. Chinese players have swarmed the server, make up the majority of players at times, not caring about the community of twow and instead creating their own community for lack of english proficiency. There's two communities. The veteran and non-veteran english speaking players and the non-english speaking players. It does not help the twow community to allow the use of hanzi in non public channels. The non-english speaking players will keep themselves segregated from the rest of the community. That wouldnt be a problem if they made up like 100 people in their own guild chat using chinese, kyrillic, greek, arabic, braille.. whatever. You'd still have a community of twow players that speak english and that make up 95% of all players. It becomes a problem when 50%+ of the players segregate themselves in their own community. The sea server is especially made for them to cater to their needs of not being able to speak english. There is no need for people who truely want to integrate into the european server twow community to be able to use hanzi, neither in public, nor in private channels.

Hello, thank you for your rational discussion. I also have a few thoughts on your concerns and issues.

1.After the Chinese server is opened, non-English-speaking Chinese players will be able to play the game without using a VPN or acceleration service because the server is closer to China. A large number of such players will enter the Chinese server as expected, which will significantly improve the performance of the old server.

2.Chinese players living outside China have foreign friends as well as friends who speak the same language. In addition to using English for communication, they also need to use their mother tongue for private communication. This is the same as the needs of other non-English-speaking players. There is no reason to completely block Chinese alone, even though this is an English server.

3.The server rules do not stipulate that you cannot communicate in your mother tongue in private. If it is only because some non-English-speaking players broke the rules because they did not understand English, and then all Chinese players who follow the rules have to bear all the punishments, it seems inappropriate.

I hope we can understand each other. Thank you

I even speak English to people of my mother tongue. You csn too and if you can't, well you know where the door will be (sea server)

[Darktifa]

I said my piece.

Cockroaches can speak their mind too
Nobody cares
They get stepped over!

There are things I'd say as a fellow Balkanite that unfortunately I can't due to the rules. So all I'll say is this: ;).

I'm happy you learned your lesson Mr non toxic internet stranger!
We both know that in real life and not hiding behind a keyboard, you wouldn't even dare to call me names

[Hctwowfan]

Hello, thank you for your rational discussion. I also have a few thoughts on your concerns and issues.

1.After the Chinese server is opened, non-English-speaking Chinese players will be able to play the game without using a VPN or acceleration service because the server is closer to China. A large number of such players will enter the Chinese server as expected, which will significantly improve the performance of the old server.

2.Chinese players living outside China have foreign friends as well as friends who speak the same language. In addition to using English for communication, they also need to use their mother tongue for private communication. This is the same as the needs of other non-English-speaking players. There is no reason to completely block Chinese alone, even though this is an English server.

3.The server rules do not stipulate that you cannot communicate in your mother tongue in private. If it is only because some non-English-speaking players broke the rules because they did not understand English, and then all Chinese players who follow the rules have to bear all the punishments, it seems inappropriate.

I hope we can understand each other. Thank you

If you cannot speak english in a quality that is sufficient to communicate with people from your own non-english country, you are part of the problem and should move to the sea server. There is no need to speak in your own language, neither in private conversations, nor in gchat, nor in public channels. Nobody cares if 2 people /w in chinese or dutch or norwegian. We care if 7000 people segregate themselves from the established community.

I dont have the slightest idea how many people from my own country I might have met in twow in the past 15 months, because there is no need to speak our language if we are sufficiently proficient in speaking english. If I run into you in game, you're not norwegian or dutch or french or german, you're troll, orc, dwarf or gnome. Nobody cares where you're from, because it does not make any difference to me if you integrate into the community. I start to care when you and 7000 other players cant integrate and displace people that a) follow the rules and b) are part of a community and c) have been here long before you decided to swarm the server.

If you're keen on having your own seperate community of non-english speaking people, there's a new server coming exactly for this. Make your own community elsewhere, we already have one here. And no, there's not enough space for two communities to coexist next to one another if your refuse to speak english. Why do you think we dont have a problem with people from norway, the netherlands, brazil, russia, austria, any fucking place where english is not the language? Because players from these countries usually integrate into the community by speaking english.

The tos also state that the rules may change. And they do now, cause turtle wow is turning into turd wow and something has to be done about it.

[Geojak]

Well to fair, if Chinese is enabled in just whispers I see no issue with it.

But group chat guild chat /China will allow to just continue the current situation even after the split

[Jammyxx]

The best decision TWoW ever made.... Goodbye Chinese go ruin your own server.

[Azuladrip]

Cockroaches can speak their mind too
Nobody cares
They get stepped over!

There are things I'd say as a fellow Balkanite that unfortunately I can't due to the rules. So all I'll say is this: ;).

I'm happy you learned your lesson Mr non toxic internet stranger!
We both know that in real life and not hiding behind a keyboard, you wouldn't even dare to call me names

Obviously not, that wouldn't be very Christian of me.

[Ww2304656]

so Chinese has a Ghost Tiger mount?

[Karrados]

Turtle WoW is committed to fostering an inclusive and diverse community where people from all nations and backgrounds can come together to enjoy the game. We want to clarify that we hold no discriminatory views towards any nation or group.

Our primary goal is to provide the best possible experience for all our players, ensuring a friendly and welcoming environment.

I will discuss potential exceptions for the Hanzi character support on our existing realm at the next senior team meeting, but I can't promise anything at this point.

Give them a finger, and they'll take the whole hand. They will get their own Server where they can type in their language freely. Don't let false accusations of discrimination turn the Western Server into a cesspool.

[Skumbanana]

If devs went with what many more discriminate peolel demanded. Like outright Bann all Chinese Emails, IP Adresse, gelock Or queue prio based on ping.yes that would be very unfair to the Chinese Player that integrated into the English community and never been an issue.

But the devs, despite your allegations, are wise and fair. They offer every player a choice where to play. But the rules are rules. It's an English server and there will be a Chinese server. Everyone will be catered too.

Banning hanzi is a necessity because there are just so many chinese. Because if you don't do it you have 2 servers that are Chinese majorly spoken and all international English players are screwed like we are atm.

Be happy the devs are fair and make an own server for Chinese instead of just Bann you like real racists would do

+1

[Akalix]

Greetings.

I will assume there is a cultural disconnect as comparing a video game service to the slaughter of millions in brutal concentration camps is extremely offensive.

Nonetheless, we are establishing a new realm with lower latency and native language support for our Chinese players. I do not see how this is "discrimination" -- it's objectively improving the experience. None of the experience will otherwise be different -- the same rules, the same content, and the same Turtle WoW experience.

[Edgarfam]

Greetings.

I will assume there is a cultural disconnect as comparing a video game service to the slaughter of millions in brutal concentration camps is extremely offensive.

Nonetheless, we are establishing a new realm with lower latency and native language support for our Chinese players. I do not see how this is "discrimination" -- it's objectively improving the experience. None of the experience will otherwise be different -- the same rules, the same content, and the same Turtle WoW experience.

He deserves to.be BANNED for this, or you'll get more discrimination and facist accusations.

They'll consider this is a win and this way really works.

[108]

Only thing I worried about is I cant have chinese translated quests and NPC names.It will be a trouble to me since I cant remember those english names.But It might not be a big deal.

imo you can still use a translated client, you just can't send messages with hanzi in chat

[Flamefist]

Greetings.

I will assume there is a cultural disconnect as comparing a video game service to the slaughter of millions in brutal concentration camps is extremely offensive.

Nonetheless, we are establishing a new realm with lower latency and native language support for our Chinese players. I do not see how this is "discrimination" -- it's objectively improving the experience. None of the experience will otherwise be different -- the same rules, the same content, and the same Turtle WoW experience.

Thank you for your reply
I believe the new server will significantly improve our current gaming experience. The concentration camp-related remarks mentioned in the topic may be a bit exaggerated, but I also explained that in the context of opening a new server while completely banning all Chinese support on the old server, it is like driving all Chinese users to a restricted area and isolating them from others. If something looks like an apple, smells like an apple, and tastes like an apple, then it is an apple.

If there was no such measure of banning Chinese in the old server, I would not associate it with the so-called concentration camp. In fact, I think it is unnecessary to ban Chinese when a new server is open. A complete ban is actually discrimination, because there are better alternatives, unless you believe that the new server with lower latency and less queue will not attract all non-English-speaking Chinese players.

I also proposed a feasible solution to the problems facing the old server, which is to ban the transmission of non-Latin characters in public channels. This has been verified to be effective on the Elysium server.

[Karrados]

The Chinese were the first one to start isolating themself when they refused to speak/write English and formed their own communities while excluding non-Chinese. So don't give us that Spiel.

[Redmagejoe]

Mods, just lock this thread. There's no point arguing with someone who doesn't want to hear reason.

Flamefist: The Staff does not care what you say. They are going to turn off server-side support for Hanzi. They will not change their mind. You will accept it and continue playing, or you will quit. We the rest of the community will not care either way. Nothing you do or say can change these facts, and you can reply to me if it will make you feel better, but it will make 0 difference.

Have a day.

[Foobs]

At this point Flamefist or rather "Flamefest" is just trolling everyone. This person probably has a vested interest in making sure he and his fellow cohorts have access to a line of communication that admins of the English speaking server do not understand.

*Takes off aluminum tin foil hat*

[Warhammer40k]

If the turtle discriminates and bans Chinese, can I get my donated money back? Because I don't have the service I want anymore.

[Hctwowfan]

If the turtle discriminates and bans Chinese, can I get my donated money back? Because I don't have the service I want anymore.

This is not how a donation works anywhere in the entire world, so no.

[Profgiggles]

If the turtle discriminates and bans Chinese, can I get my donated money back? Because I don't have the service I want anymore.

The motivation for donating isn't to get services. That's just something they are kind enough to give you as a thank you. The motivation for donating should be to donate and support the development team.

This rather shows that you view your donation as a transaction for service, which it is not. You're asking for money which you donated freely to be returned to you, which I have to say is both questionable and very bad form.

[Mac]

If the turtle discriminates and bans Chinese, can I get my donated money back? Because I don't have the service I want anymore.

They aren’t getting banned. In fact, they’re getting their own server.

[Darrakus]

If the turtle discriminates and bans Chinese, can I get my donated money back? Because I don't have the service I want anymore.

Tell me, in what sense is getting your very own realm closer to you than EU discrimination?

[Edgarfam]

If the turtle discriminates and bans Chinese, can I get my donated money back? Because I don't have the service I want anymore.

Is the measure discriminative? No.

Can someone get donated money back? Maybe.

Can you get your money back? No.

Will you still play on this server? Yes.

[Mac]

Can Turtle Wow please discriminate against me and make a server just for me?

[Redmagejoe]

If the turtle discriminates and bans Chinese, can I get my donated money back? Because I don't have the service I want anymore.

See viewtopic.php?p=60250#p60250 for the answer to your question.

[Lahire]

My native language is not english.
But I learned it to be able to communicate with other playes around the world.

Explain to me : why is it so difficult for CN players to accept to communicate in english, which is basic politeness on a worldwide server ?

Do we french ask the right to flood the /world with our "bonjour baguette saucisse minitel" ? No.
Why some people can't accomodate ?

Cela étant, la supériorité manifeste de la FRONSE impose que vous nous donniez notre propre serveur car notre Empire des Mille Départements s'étend sur l'entièreté du globe ! <emoji coq> /s

[Thecakeisalie]

The majority of western players are not native english speakers, but english is the prefered language across borders.

Chinese players should read the room, follow the rules and adapt accordingly. But many have not so far.

”When in Rome, do as the Romans.”

[Ww2304656]

you can not breath?

[Ishilu]

The concentration camp-related remarks mentioned in the topic may be a bit exaggerated

"A bit exaggerated" does not even begin to cover it. Your remark is utterly inacceptible, even considering that you're not european. Period. You have been informed about this by several people, including a green guy. There's no excuse and no room for debate about this one and you should simply apologize. You're putting the chinese playerbase into a very bad light with your behaviour.

About chinese support:
Chinese support is great on a chinese server like the one that's being set up for you. It's completely unnecessary for a western server. Any claim that the current situation (login queues, overfarmed zones, indecipherable world chat etc) is in any way beneficial for the server or anybodys gaming experience is either naive or a lie and I won't speculate about motivations for the latter.

About splitting the community:
It is already split. There are people who have been following server rules, sometimes for several years and there are thousands of new guys who are unable or simply refuse to integrate into the existing community. These groups won't really miss each other because they haven't interacted in any pleasant way in the first place. /wave and /smile don't count, sorry.
Removing chinese support from the western realm will give people a much needed incentive to migrate and I hope you folks can transfer your characters and are not forced to start again from square one, though.

[Ghola]

average day in stormwind!

[Wowplaya69]

You're putting the chinese playerbase into a very bad light with your behaviour.

Basing your opinion of a an entire racial or cultural group based on your experience with one person who is part of that group is the very definition of racism. You, like other posters on this board, are also threatening your dissenters with more racism.

The discussion of this topic on this forum is full of petty name calling, ad-hominem attacks and railroading. So pretending this guy has broken some treasured social norms is just bullshitting.

He feels that he's been vilified based on his race, even an idiot can understand that he feels that way regardless of how he's expressed it, agree with him or not, it's clear that your post is intended to confirm his feelings of racial vilification.

@turtlewow team : you run a great service, I respect your decision to run it how you like, but you've allowed a toxic community to foster on these boards.. maybe you launched the SEA server for good reasons but when you let racism foster in so many of these threads it looks like you support it.

[Ishilu]

The post I have quoted was the OP doing something we call "relativization of history" in germany. If you don't know about this, just look up "Geschichtsrelativierung" on the internet. It's a very, very bad thing and I'll just leave it at that. My criticism is harsh but for a good reason. This is bigger than a discussion about non latin characters in a videogame and I sincerely hope the OP learns and grows from this.

Cultural fauxpas can happen and it's -in my opinion- something that can be brushed off as "shit happens", as long as the person doing so acknowledge that they have been insulting and act accordingly afterwards. The OP doesn't seem to do so to this point, however, which in turn reveals some degree of ignorance and lack of respect. That's why the OP is failing miserably if his intention was really to bring western and chinese players closer together. He's making a poor example for the chinese community.

Now the problem is that people normally have a stronger perception of bad things happening in everyday life for various reasons. It's the same thing here.

I can safely assume that there are plenty of chinese players who follow server rules and are respectful towards the whole community. But these guys are hidden behind the fact that they are behaving in a way that can reasonably be expected from everybody here, regrdless of their origin. We see them ingame and on the forums and due to their behaviour we have no clue whether they're from china, the US, europe or Madagascar and we don't really care. Same goes for nice people from all over the world on this server. Considering we all live in different information bubbles, that's very important to keep the atmosphere on the server friendly. That's also why the GMs work hard to keep political discussions out of world chat.

However, there are also the guys who feel the need broadcast their country of origin for some reason (not only china, ofc) and that is often frowned upon on this server. Players insisting on the use of non-latin characters in public chat and claiming that they're right to do so and the others should just adapt to them take this behaviour to another level. Same as above: inadvertendly insulting people happens, but the right thing when being called out about it is apologizing and learning from one's mistakes.

I can also safely assume that the vast majority of players insisting that hanzi characters in public channels are not bad or even a good thing and that banning the use of these characters would be a bad thing are originating from china and not italy. Big surprise. That has nothing to do with racism.

[Wowplaya69]

blah blah blah... you projected your impression of one person onto a whole culture, you were racist.

There may have been better ways for him to express his feelings of cultural vilification but that doesn't invalidate his feelings or justify your racist response.

[Magicorck]

u got the point!
and may fans should support your advice

[Shaman111]

blah blah blah.. racist.

Great majority of cn players live in a fevered dream where they think they gonna make a living farming gold here to sell to westerners. This is why they got so rabid at the notion of having to move playing only with their fellow countrymen