Patch 1.17.0 — Beyond the Greymane Wall

[Kyzen]

Scarlet Citadel is scrapped and the main developer is replaced with a druid player this time around.

Bruh, say it ain't so. I thought that the rumors of a turtle-dev leaving was just reddit trashtalk.....

Was also looking forward to that raid/dungeon.

Please, don't spread weird rumors and misinformation. The Citadel development is on hold because we've decided to not use the upscaled Vanilla WMO of the merged Scarlet Monastery but come up with something unique and better in the future.

What about Outland (it was even featured on a YouTube video on Twow old channel) ? (I'm just curious)

[Torta]

Bruh, say it ain't so. I thought that the rumors of a turtle-dev leaving was just reddit trashtalk.....

Was also looking forward to that raid/dungeon.

Please, don't spread weird rumors and misinformation. The Citadel development is on hold because we've decided to not use the upscaled Vanilla WMO of the merged Scarlet Monastery but come up with something unique and better in the future.

What about Outland (it was even featured on a YouTube video on Twow old channel) ? (I'm just curious)

Outland is still on the table :)

[Geojak]

i saw the emerald dreasm trailer.
thank you turtle team for getting my childhood dream wow server to reeality
oh how much did i wish emerald dream patch came out instead of tbc back in 2007

[Gantulga]

I assume Emerald Sanctum will count as an outdoor zone?

[Nightowl]

The Citadel development is on hold because we've decided to not use the upscaled Vanilla WMO of the merged Scarlet Monastery but come up with something unique and better in the future.

Aw, that's unfortunate. I thought it was really cool that you guys were using that unused WMO for the raid.

Even upscaled, it appeared to be too small for the 40-player adventure. We encountered so many issues with it, so at some point it was decided to start over with a different model.

Why can't you make it 20man raid then? Or if it's still too many, a cool 10man dungeon akin to Upper Blackrock Spire. Wiping the canvas clean after all that work seems really strange to me and if it's because you're not confident in room for the actual raid, you can always reduce it to a cool dungeon 5man dungeon if it's really that little space.

Just don't throw my Crusade homies under the bus like that T_T

[Torta]

Aw, that's unfortunate. I thought it was really cool that you guys were using that unused WMO for the raid.

Even upscaled, it appeared to be too small for the 40-player adventure. We encountered so many issues with it, so at some point it was decided to start over with a different model.

Why can't you make it 20man raid then? Or if it's still too many, a cool 10man dungeon akin to Upper Blackrock Spire. Wiping the canvas clean after all that work seems really strange to me and if it's because you're not confident in room for the actual raid, you can always reduce it to a cool dungeon 5man dungeon if it's really that little space.

Just don't throw my Crusade homies under the bus like that T_T

Do not worry. The story is developed, and it's getting a continuation as soon as we have the right assets :)

[Karrados]

Please don't forget that this Server/Game has two factions, there is more than just High Elf / Alliance.

[Nightowl]

Please don't forget that this Server/Game has two factions, there is more than just High Elf / Alliance.

Lies. This server is Alliance + Alliance Shamans in denial.

To be fair how hard would be to write an actual Warsong Leader to be a ballbuster who doesn't take shit from anyone, be it Thrall or Saurfang.

"You may be Warchief, boy, but that does not mean that I will watch as you destroy our people by refusing them the right to conquer the much needed resources! My Warsong clan will continue to secure Lumber for Horde's success either you like it or not"!

- Kahlagg Axerage, leader of Warsong Clan.

Just a simple questline to showcase that Thrall ain't the Big Dick Jesus everything think he is. A few discussions here and there and boom, now Horde's back in business. Honestly, I can write an ashenvale questchain that ends with a Warsong commander sending his report via you - the player - to Thralls Stronghold, and when you deliver it you get to watch a cool exchange between Thrall and a Warsong Leader who's butts heads with Thrall (if people want).

Lorewise it makes sense. Horde lives in a fucking desert. They need resources which is why I always felt that "peacemaker" Thrall couldn't just go Green Jesus and go "no my fellow disciples, violence is wrong"! since that shit doesn't work when your people got nothing to eat or work with.

Little things like that would make Horde so much better than it currently is. Fucking Tauren have more political shit going on between Cairne and Grimtotem Crone.

[Noce]

can we get some hint on what are u planning to do with classes, if any changes at all?
plan on balancing out some op cc, buffs and such?

[Jongyi]

Please don't forget that this Server/Game has two factions, there is more than just High Elf / Alliance.

High elves are very underdeveloped compared to their horde counterparts, goblins who have three functioning towns with npcs and quests. People have just starting to notice how high elves have almost no screen presence from their starting area and Alah'thalas. There is nothing wrong with devs and volunteers giving more spotlight to them.

[Andromath]

Please don't forget that this Server/Game has two factions, there is more than just High Elf / Alliance.

I'm happy for any improvements to the server, no matter which faction benefits from it more. I'm certainly biased in favor of High Elf content, but we don't know what use these new assets are being put to other than cosmetic at this time.

What kind of content would you like to see added for the Horde?

[Illyane]

Taurens actually have no direct conflict with humans, so I think it is perfectly possible to make Taurens neutral race who can join Alliance. It should look like taurens are on both sides. Alliance version of taurens could be paladins, while Horde version can't.

There are more reasons for the Tauren to be with the Horde than with the Alliance.
From a conceptual point of view, it doesn't make sense to change the alignment of the Taurens.
Firstly, because the Horde saved them from extermination and helped them settle in Mulgore, ending a thousand years of migrations and warfare since the destruction of Mashan'she by Theradras, that's where their loyalty to the Horde comes from.
Secondly, the Taurens are spiritually neutral, not politically neutral. It is the following of Earth Mother's teachings that makes them neutral: To protect the Great Cycle of Life and perpetuate the Great Hunt, they do not consider the Shadow as immoral and the Light as moral: These are both necessary parts of an overall balance and balance is the key. Most of the neutral Tauren you see are the Tauren of the Cenarian Circle and the Earthen Ring, organisations that protect harmony (in Nature, between the elements). The reason you see Taurens friendly to the Alliance is often because they are associated with these organisations. And that's without mentioning the Grimtotems who see the Tauren as the chosen ones of Mother Earth and have a claim to all of central Kalimdor.
Finally, the Dwarves are literally encroaching on Tauren lands with their excavations (Bael Modan, Bael'dun, Bael Hardun now, etc.) to the point of killing Tauren to protect their dig sites.

As for Tauren Paladins, since the concept of Light in the Tauren Society is totally related to the twin children of Mother Earth, An'she and Mu'sha and not the teachings of the Church of the Holy Light, Tauren worshippers of An'she are in no way related to a light-dark dichotomy as are the Paladins of the Alliance, since light is in balance with shadow. If the concept of Tauren Paladins is possible from the start, it has nothing to do with Alliance membership.

[Illyane]

(Sorry for "Mother Earth", online correctors heavily dislike "Earth Mother". They are in cahoot with the Twilight Hammer for sure.)

[Galendor]

Miscellaneous

• The Farstrider Lodge is getting a new look! More accurate to its High Elven legacy. The gilded exterior blending with the natural wilds showcases both the ancestral ties to the Kaldorei, as well as the pride and progress of their civilization before the coming of the Scourge.

I'm confused a bit. Don't you wish to replace the Farstrider Lodge (and other lodges) with more thalassian one? We already have an example of TBC elven architecture so it should be lore-friendly, right?

[Jongyi]

Miscellaneous

• The Farstrider Lodge is getting a new look! More accurate to its High Elven legacy. The gilded exterior blending with the natural wilds showcases both the ancestral ties to the Kaldorei, as well as the pride and progress of their civilization before the coming of the Scourge.

I'm confused a bit. Don't you wish to replace the Farstrider Lodge (and other lodges) with more thalassian one? We already have an example of TBC elven architecture so it should be lore-friendly, right?

i think it might be issue with the landscape. While devs already have high elven buildings game objects, this type of building might not be compatible with landscape as it can cause some clipping (just my guess that i have some experience with placing game objects)
Or they might be reserving new high elf architecture for future contents and farstrider's lodges in vanilla are usually use same lodge design. (farstrider's lodge, quel'danil and quel'lithien sharing same game object model). it might be intended design wise.

[Goldshrehoslayr]

The restoration of the immortal champion drake has finally given me an excuse to avoid Stormwind altogether. Terrible RP immersion when you've got people idling around all day on huge blue drakes and rogues with double-tmogged thunderfuries (which is hilarious).

[Andromath]

i think it might be issue with the landscape. While devs already have high elven buildings game objects, this type of building might not be compatible with landscape as it can cause some clipping (just my guess that i have some experience with placing game objects)
Or they might be reserving new high elf architecture for future contents and farstrider's lodges in vanilla are usually use same lodge design. (farstrider's lodge, quel'danil and quel'lithien sharing same game object model). it might be intended design wise.

As much as I would love to see the in-game lodges like in Hinterlands, Loch Modan, and the Eastern Plaguelands updated, I agree that the size of them is probably the issue. The Kaldorei style lodge is pretty huge, but the High Elven one is, I think, even larger, and that's not taking into account the side-chamber entrances. Even if you closed them off and partially buried the building inside the mountain, the other side would have a ramp leading off into thin air, and while some scaffolding might result in a makeshift kind of deck, it wouldn't look good at all.

Its been a while since I've been out to the Hinterlands, but it might be more possible to update that lodge, than the one in Loch Modan. That, and I think using the High Elven buildings in the Hinterlands would be more lore-friendly, if the comics are anything to go by.

[Jongyi]

i think it might be issue with the landscape. While devs already have high elven buildings game objects, this type of building might not be compatible with landscape as it can cause some clipping (just my guess that i have some experience with placing game objects)
Or they might be reserving new high elf architecture for future contents and farstrider's lodges in vanilla are usually use same lodge design. (farstrider's lodge, quel'danil and quel'lithien sharing same game object model). it might be intended design wise.

As much as I would love to see the in-game lodges like in Hinterlands, Loch Modan, and the Eastern Plaguelands updated, I agree that the size of them is probably the issue. The Kaldorei style lodge is pretty huge, but the High Elven one is, I think, even larger, and that's not taking into account the side-chamber entrances. Even if you closed them off and partially buried the building inside the mountain, the other side would have a ramp leading off into thin air, and while some scaffolding might result in a makeshift kind of deck, it wouldn't look good at all.

Its been a while since I've been out to the Hinterlands, but it might be more possible to update that lodge, than the one in Loch Modan. That, and I think using the High Elven buildings in the Hinterlands would be more lore-friendly, if the comics are anything to go by.

I agree with Quel'Danil situation. In lore and in manga, it was supposed to be bigger.
it is clearly thalassian architecture. Characters from the manga the twin Loania, Lieren are also in the game including their mentor high elf Voldana All of these characters have a few in-game quest, but brief and not a lot. Devs might or might not expand their story further. Would be cool to see the manga character playing some role in future storyline though.
Back to my point, Quel'Danil could use a bit of the facelift and add a couple more buildings and npcs to the area as lorewise, it is one of pretty important location. They even have dragonhawks at the lodge in lore.
The only thing that might hinder them from fully upgrading the area is that it is horde quest-target area. But like you have said in other post about Quel'danil, it could be solved by some expansion and relocating some quest target npcs while leaving the main area with proper guards (so that quest npc and vendors couldn't be griefed) and proper npcs with dialogue. Lets see what have devs in mind with this area in future updates.

[Jongyi]

Damn, my image doesn't load. But i think you can still see it with Open Image in new tab.

[Andromath]

I agree with Quel'Danil situation. In lore and in manga, it was supposed to be bigger.
it is clearly thalassian architecture. Characters from the manga the twin Loania, Lieren are also in the game including their mentor high elf Voldana All of these characters have a few in-game quest, but brief and not a lot. Devs might or might not expand their story further. Would be cool to see the manga character playing some role in future storyline though.
Back to my point, Quel'Danil could use a bit of the facelift and add a couple more buildings and npcs to the area as lorewise, it is one of pretty important location. They even have dragonhawks at the lodge in lore.
The only thing that might hinder them from fully upgrading the area is that it is horde quest-target area. But like you have said in other post about Quel'danil, it could be solved by some expansion and relocating some quest target npcs while leaving the main area with proper guards (so that quest npc and vendors couldn't be griefed) and proper npcs with dialogue. Lets see what have devs in mind with this area in future updates.

Expanding the lodge certainly feels like the way to go about it, in my opinion. Alternatively, placing the NPCs for the Horde quest further away from it, perhaps in a camp somewhere, might work as well.

[Galendor]

i think it might be issue with the landscape. While devs already have high elven buildings game objects, this type of building might not be compatible with landscape as it can cause some clipping (just my guess that i have some experience with placing game objects)
Or they might be reserving new high elf architecture for future contents and farstrider's lodges in vanilla are usually use same lodge design. (farstrider's lodge, quel'danil and quel'lithien sharing same game object model). it might be intended design wise.

As far as I understand it, devs are using tools for landscape editing in recent updates (that's why I still have a hope for enhancing both Alah'Thalas and Amani'Alor in terms of terrain and structures), so replacing a lodge shouldn't cause a problem with terrain so far.

[Andromath]

It'd sure be nice to see Alah'Thalas expanded. Maybe use of a proper docks building such as we see in Eversong or on Quel'Danas. Almost seems odd there isn't an Arcane Sanctum there either.

I imagine they're using Noggit for world edits? It's been years since I've kept up with it, but I recall there used to be issues, particularly where water was concerned. That made making any edits to the existing world tricky.

[Kyzen]

Please, don't spread weird rumors and misinformation. The Citadel development is on hold because we've decided to not use the upscaled Vanilla WMO of the merged Scarlet Monastery but come up with something unique and better in the future.

What about Outland (it was even featured on a YouTube video on Twow old channel) ? (I'm just curious)

Outland is still on the table :)

[Kefke]

The Quel'dorei fleet was not completely wiped out after the fall of Quel'thalas. Some of their iconic destroyers are returning to serve their people again!

Sea route from Alah'Thalas?

[Illyane]

The restoration of the immortal champion drake has finally given me an excuse to avoid Stormwind altogether. Terrible RP immersion when you've got people idling around all day on huge blue drakes and rogues with double-tmogged thunderfuries (which is hilarious).

I feel ya

[Illyane]

Wait, I searched everywhere and didn't find clues on the forum about the restauration of the drake mount. Is this a thing or made up ? I hope it isn't. "Drakes everywhere" is really, well, meh IMO.

[Bittermens]

May i suggest https://www.wowhead.com/spell=219853/mi ... ilver-hand as a passive bonus for paladins AFTER completing the Turn Undead questline?

[Kairion]

May i suggest https://www.wowhead.com/spell=219853/mi ... ilver-hand as a passive bonus for paladins AFTER completing the Turn Undead questline?

Ye because 2-3k dps paly in nax is totally not over the top

[Bittermens]

May i suggest https://www.wowhead.com/spell=219853/mi ... ilver-hand as a passive bonus for paladins AFTER completing the Turn Undead questline?

Ye because 2-3k dps paly in nax is totally not over the top

Well paladins have no racial in general on this new class racial roulette.
And originally this is a holy paladin passive.

[Kairion]

Take all the time you need to find out why it was scrapped

Most classes have no racial class spells, and a 1k dps passive certainly is a absolute dealbreaker for race selection.

[Karrados]

And the Racial class spells that were added in Turtle are really questionable when it comes to their actual use. There is nothing insane like a passive that would just boost their damage against the main enemy of the endgame Raid by 100%.

[Whalemilk]

Check out the racial spell suggestions I’ve posted in the past.

As seen in my signature

[Jombo]

@Torta I wonder if there will be an early patch with the new class options as well as other "smaller" things (I mean, small in comparison to a whole new zone and raid :-) ). That would really be great to get people back and interested before the big release. Also, I will finally continue playing my huntard which will be race changed to human =)

[Whalemilk]

Can you please put NPC’s on boats & blimps.

It would be so nice to be able to vendor or buy some food.

Also, it would make it look more lively

[Bigguy05]

Any chance of an Elven Warlock in the future?