Please lower or remove the restrictions on transmogrification.

[Monmothma21]

If you could give your opinions on each of those points separately, I think that would be very helpful.

1)Allowing to transmog X-type in to Y-type is ok for as long as your character can wear those types. You should be able to transmog in to everything your character has proficiency to wear. It will limit some classes alot in what they can do, but, meh? You can try and add more transmog-specific gear later to compensate for it. Like some kind of lvl 1 cloth gear made specificly for transmoging purposes, with unique model. Or, if you can/want/have means to, add a way to convert some of the existing equipment in to transmog material by breaking it? It could even be its very own dedicated profession?

2)Are there some kind of hard technical limitations in this client that prevents you from doing/forcing changes anyway? Or it will just look silly? Ive seen transmog on other servers where they force animations to change, depending on whatever your weapon is transmog-ed in to. Some times it works, some times it uses wrong animations, but in my experience it looked ok. If there is some kind of technical limitations that will break the game if you force it, they yes, limiting it would be the only way. But if it will just look silly - imo, let it happen.

3)For as long as its not (in any way or form) gated by donor shop - im personaly up to whatever. A lot of servers make it in to pay-to-get feature, which is understandable but sad. Having the ability to get them by playing the game is great.

[Qixel]

Let me start with saying that we have seen your complaints and this topic has also been discussed a lot within the team. What I can say at this time is that transmog restrictions will be reevaluated at some point in the probably-not-so-far-future (just as everything else that we receive feedback on). Please keep in mind that this doesn't necessarily mean they will also be changed.

That said, I would like to make clear that the discussion features at least three components that can and should be treated separately because they differ in controversy:

First of all, thank you for taking the time to respond to my thread. I hope that the eventual decision will be favorable.

1) Armor type restrictions
That means the +1/-1 armor type restriction that is currently in place. It does not mean that you cannot transmog armor of a type your character isn't able to equip. The latter will very likely never change. Instead, removing that restriction would allow e.g. shamans to transmog mail pieces with cloth or paladins to transmog their cloth pieces with plate.

The old system allowed for transmogging your armor to anything you had, and it posed no issues. It enabled lots of really fun ideas, from overhauls of expectations like offensive spell casting paladins, to a hood that fit the color scheme of a warrior's outfit. The idea that this "cannot" happen is flawed, to me, seeing as we already had it, and it was good. My position is to allow people to wear whatever they have. If we must discriminate against clothies, I would propose the ability to spend fashion coins (or even just like a bunch of gold) to unlock items you cannot equip as a work around.

2) Weapon type restrictions
This means that weapons can only be transmogged with weapons of the same type. From what I can tell, this is a lot more controversial than armor types due to various reasons. If weapon type restrictions would be removed, however, this would only allow the following cross-type transmogs: 1H-Axe<->1H-Sword<->1H-Mace and 2H-Axe<->2H-Sword<->2H-Mace. The reason for this is that those are the only types that share the same swing animations. To be more specific: You wouldn't be able to transmog a dagger with a 1H-Sword or a polearm with a staff, because those have different swing animations.

I feel that allowing people to transmog weapons that share an animation would be a great thing. For those unaware of what shares animations, the animation groups are as follows: [One Handed Sword/Mace/Axe], [Two Handed Sword/Mace/Axe], [Fist Weapons], [Daggers], [Polearms/Staves], [Guns/Crossbows (albeit they use different ammo)], and [Bow].

3) Transmog costs
This means the money/time invest needed for a single transmog coin.

Now that you can earn more than one coin a week, I feel that this is in a good spot. However, I would add back the ability to earn transmog coins at all levels. I will also reiterate my idea to spend transmog coins or gold to unlock appearances of items you cannot equip if we must limit the options of clothies.

[Toirto]

Hello this is Vargash
Just have to say it is absolutely ridiculous that Holy Paladins can't transmog cloth to plate

Sincerly Vargash

[Xerron]

Hello this is Vargash
Just have to say it is absolutely ridiculous that Holy Paladins can't transmog cloth to plate

Sincerly Vargash

this tbh

[Chnams]

If you could give your opinions on each of those points separately, I think that would be very helpful.

1) I personally think anyone should be able to transmog to any piece that they can equip. So a mage will only be able to transmog cloth, but a warrior can transmog everything from plate to cloth. I think it just makes the most sense.
2) I'm personally completely fine with mogging weapons into other weapons, and if the reason why some weapons
can't transmogged into others is animation issues, then there's not much we can do about it. Otherwise, weapons definitely should be moggable into other weapon types, as far as the animations will allow.
3) I think the cost for fashion tokens is very steep and it just gets higher and higher as you level. I think it'd be nice if it worked like DMF coupons, where you can turn in a few low level items for 1 coin, higher level items for 2 coins, higher still for 3 coins, etc. Cap it at 5 coins for a collection of lvl 50-60 items. Basically, with better materials you get more coins, but obviously those materials can be harder to find because they're higher level, just like the darkmoon faire tokens. Hopefully I'm not being too confusing with my description :D

[Exizefra]

I cannot say much about removing the armor class restrictions (allowing to show cloth as a plate or staff as a axe and whatever) - but i'll ask to make transmogable a decorative and fun items. Like events and pure cosmetic clothes (for example a Christmas hats and Lunar Festive dresses and jackets that don't have an armor type and can't be used for a transmog), off-hand items (fish and flowers), gray and white hats that makes characters look like a grampa, head slot roses - all that funny stuff that, as i think, are the first items for a transmog. But now they're can't be used for that because of restrictions or whatever - so it makes them quite useless because of no stats and i doubt that anyone carries it in their bags for fun changing. So I think they should be maked fully versatile in a transmog - it will make them...well, usable for something and always actual. And fun, of course - some players love to make their characters looks hillarious.

[Dhakkel]

Absolutely +1 to "allow people to transmog whatever the hell they want".

Armor sets: This is, at its core, a PVERP server. Lets let the PVERPers actually RP. There are a lot of cloth pieces that I'd LOVE to transmog on my plate warrior (wizard hat, I'm looking at you!). Likewise, there's a lot of mail that'd look fantastic on a warlock.

Weapon sets: As far as weapon restrictions go, again, I think as long as you have earned the item, you should be able to tmog it. Again, there are some great items I'd love to tmog but cannot equip them. My gardener mage will never be complete until she can equip her shovel.

As for costs: I think the current costs are fine if you can tie it to slot rather than 1 item. Farming for a coin, using it, then getting a new hat 2 levels later and having to farm another coin makes tmog absolutely not worth it until 60, and that's not fun. I have a bunch of 20s that I'd be grinding coins on if I knew I'd be able to keep my look for as long as I want. (That being said, the 50-59 tier needs reworking regardless.)

In defense of the "clown" argument: remember, most people won't use this system at all. A lot of people still don't know about gardening, or tents, or even how xfaction works. A lot of people just wanna play vanilla WoW, and Turtle is currently the best place to do that. Allowing RPers (and anyone else who wants to dress up!) the ability to look how they want, using items they've earned, is a fantastic way of adding yet another great feature to TWoW.

[Cytonek]

1) I believe we should be able to mog any kind of armor that is compatible with our class. I dont see why paladins cant mog their plate with cloth. All this allows is for creative outfits.

2) I am totally in agreeance with others that we should be able to mog all weapons that the class can use that have the same swing animations. I know there are a lot of swords I would like to use instead of the current axe that is equipped and vice versa. I see no real downside to a change like this.

3) Transmog costs are the biggest thing for me at the moment. I believe turtle wow should take retails approach but more lightly. A base cost that even a low level could afford per item or even better having the transmog be free. If you ever look at the main complaint with retail transmog, its that the cost is too high. I know even at level 10 I have a couple sets of armor that I wouldn't mind changing out every week. In my opinion, having the transmog be free would persuade more people to go out questing for the unique quest gear. That's exactly what I would do if transmog was free/easier to apply.

When you look around the world at the moment, barely any low levels 30-under have any gear transmoged. I believe these changes to the system would persuade others into dipping their toes into transmorgification.

Let me start with saying that we have seen your complaints and this topic has also been discussed a lot within the team. What I can say at this time is that transmog restrictions will be reevaluated at some point in the probably-not-so-far-future (just as everything else that we receive feedback on). Please keep in mind that this doesn't necessarily mean they will also be changed.

That said, I would like to make clear that the discussion features at least three components that can and should be treated separately because they differ in controversy:

1) Armor type restrictions
That means the +1/-1 armor type restriction that is currently in place. It does not mean that you cannot transmog armor of a type your character isn't able to equip. The latter will very likely never change. Instead, removing that restriction would allow e.g. shamans to transmog mail pieces with cloth or paladins to transmog their cloth pieces with plate.

2) Weapon type restrictions
This means that weapons can only be transmogged with weapons of the same type. From what I can tell, this is a lot more controversial than armor types due to various reasons. If weapon type restrictions would be removed, however, this would only allow the following cross-type transmogs: 1H-Axe<->1H-Sword<->1H-Mace and 2H-Axe<->2H-Sword<->2H-Mace. The reason for this is that those are the only types that share the same swing animations. To be more specific: You wouldn't be able to transmog a dagger with a 1H-Sword or a polearm with a staff, because those have different swing animations.

3) Transmog costs
This means the money/time invest needed for a single transmog coin.

If you could give your opinions on each of those points separately, I think that would be very helpful.

[Ugoboom]

For topics 1 and 2:
I find it extremely disappointing that the staff is holding their ground, on the issue that you must be able to equip an item, to xmog it. The old system was not like this, and everything was great, people could come up with crazy cool combinations, like full rogue t2 + ashkandi, for the edgiest set possible. Why hold your ground on this point? Why limit the creativity? I'd like reasons, that we already haven't dismantled in this thread, like how PVP concerns are easily fixed.

And equally disappointing that the staff is holding their ground on restricting weapon xmogs to animation types. It should be 0% a thought on my brain, on that I should not take a gameplay DPS upgrade, because it would ruin my xmog. Like if I had some aq40 sword, and i had the opportunity to get the naxx fist weapon. I'd lose my xmog in the process despite it being a massive upgrade. Why????? Why not just let the animations look a bit goofy. That's okay. Players being able to keep their bis xmog despite ANYTHING the game throws at it >>>>> having to mentally fight over gameplay upgrades and ruining their xmog.

Gameplay and style should be entirely 100% divorced from impacting eachother (other than the gameplay needed to aquire a style)

[Aubreykun]

1) I think that limiting it to "only what you can equip" is fine. The lack of untyped pieces being moggable (such as shirts and a few other cosmetics) seems a bit weird, but could easily be fixed by just retyping the ones that have a visual as cloth.
The inability to change types of armor for what you have equipped could be lifted though, if I understand it properly as outlined. People talk about wearing cloth as a paladin/warrior lot in the thread, but there's plenty of stylish leather pieces a warrior or paladin could use for a cool look too. After 40 that becomes nonviable.

2) Widening the range of weapon types would be a small mistake. Not a big one, but a mistake still. There's a fair number of weapons that share a model but are different types already, and it'd devalue the less-common/harder-to-find ones in favor of the path of least resistance.

Unifying 1) and 2), opening "everyone can use everything" up I think actually can devalue some of the mog hunting. Cosmetic mog-focused items being available from rep, events, turnins, hidden or long questlines, or as rare (additional, not replacement) drops from bosses and trash mobs would be wonderful and not out of the spirit of Vanilla. For example, the defias mask and the parrot and siamese companions from the deadmines, as well as other various cosmetics in the world (orb of deception, fish weapons...). For the aforementioned gardener mage, a "staff shovel" could be something to look for in world if added. That would fill a big gap for that specific item model.

For completeness sake I'll also say that well-known iconic items shouldn't be devalued by an easier-to-get cosmetic intermediary. Meaning no 'replica' raid gear, no "counts as a hammer" brightwood staff, etc. As well, faction-specific appearances should probably be the exception and not common. No ironforge-emblem shields for horde. A few items that you get from killing enemy-faction mobs in quest areas already exist to provide a small amount of flavor there, no need to make it common.

Basically, no need for Twow to start to look like maplestory

Finally,
3) I think the pattern established by the level 10 and 20 turnins could be just repeated. 5 of the appropriate cloth, 5 of that tier of leather, 5 of the most common, lowest value gem from that tier of mining, and 5 of a specific common cross-continent monster drop. As it stands you're kind of punished for not getting your mog tokens in at the 10-29 range when it's much much easier, and less costly relative to the level range. At 14, collecting the mats for the tokens cost less than it takes to get enough silver to buy a single skill. At 60 it costs far more and you have to travel much farther to farm the pieces.
Presently the middle of the range requires some esoteric crafted items that aren't even normal trainer recipes. Good for crafters to make bank due to the low supply, but the low demand limits things somewhat. They're also not linked to the level ranges at all and seem semi-random.

[N0l]

(On 1 and 2) I second Ugoboom - by default, we should have zero restrictions and then add restrictions where technically necessary, or necessary for gameplay. I cannot imagine anyone's RP experience is improved by restricting items. If my warlock would look good in mail to better fit my RP as a spellsword-esque caster, who's harmed by me transmogging my warlock to have a mail chestpiece?

The same applies to weapons/animations. I understand not wanting weapons to have "weird" animations, but I'm sure many people would agree: being able transmog fist weapons and get weird animations is better then not being able to transmog fist weapons at all. For literally everyone. Even in the case where someone doesn't want weird animations, they can simply choose not to use off-animation transmogs. Nobody loses with an all-open system.

(On 3)
I don't hugely care about the price. I'm not a transmog fiend, and transmog being expensive in gold or time investment sounds fine to me - but I think its important to decide why it should be expensive. This is a gold/reagent sink that could be used to improve the normal classic economy by creating new economic pressures, but it also means that someone who plays the AH or is otherwise good at making gold isn't going to be impacted by the price, whereas a more casual player will. For a system that seems mostly focused on people who aren't necessarily AH goblins, tying it to gold or purchasable items puts a burden on people who most want to invest time RPing rather then farming or AH baroning.

And I say that as someone who never has issues with gold. I don't care if its cheap - I'll be able to afford it anyway. But for people who spend all day RPing, making it expensive just puts more pressure on them.

[Aubreykun]

I will also add a further suggestion regarding point 3:
If the mog tokens, instead of allowing for a change, unlock "slots" which can be modified freely for a small (level-scaling) amount of money, I think that would be a good compromise.
Similar to the bank slots, the first unlock is a single mog token and the second is 3 with further ones (up to some amount) being 5. Or possibly capping at 10 tokens per later slot for the "fashion fiends". The higher level token quests then could be set up to reward more tokens. So it scales with level nicely and means that lowbies can play around with their 1 mog slot.

If this is implemented, I think it would also make sense to allow for an in-the-field outfit change, only needing to go back to the NPC to edit the outfits. With of course a "non-mogged" default look always selectable.

All of this would REALLY help out the RP element, as players could simply swap outfits for different scenes and in the middle of events.

[Allwynd01]

I don't agree that players should be restricted from transmogrifying gear into something their class can't technically wear.

Let's think about this from a lore perspective.

You are a Mage and try to equip Plate armor, you get an error message stating "You do not have the required proficiency for that item." How can this be explained in the game world if it was in a book, comic, movie, etc? A Mage finds a discarded Shield on the ground and decides to use it to fend off arrows, he tries to put it on his left arm and then the "Astral Powers of the Universe That Be" magically stop him from putting on the Shield?

This makes absolutely zero sense.

The idea of transmogrification in my opinion is being able to make your character look like anything you want despite them not being able to wear that. If this is going to have the same restriction as class proficiency, then this becomes quite useless.

Here's why.

At the cost of viability, you can equip whatever items you want despite their bonuses not being intended for your character and without requiring the existence of transmogrification.

[Sinrek]

I'd say that proficiency is similar to years of training and build up for a certain opportunity to have after additional expertise learnt.

As an example with shields - sure anyone can lift one up, no problem, however, not everyone would be able to hold it properly without training, less so using it to full extent and I'm not even saying about not breaking a sweat with simple moving around and doing your thing whoever you might be.

Sounds like people who think they can learn anything at any time just haven't ever tried that IRL.

Back on the topic though. Restrictions on weapon type are absolutely in line with PvP, lore and gameplay reasons. PvP shouldn't bring any advantage with transmogrification since some classes got a weapon type specs and weapon type perks within either class or talent trees. Same for armor. Rogue might look like he's wearing all those spell based gear or just have it transmogged to take advantage of your falsely based actions… Therefore type restrictions are necessary.

[Qixel]

Back on the topic though. Restrictions on weapon type are absolutely in line with PvP, lore and gameplay reasons. PvP shouldn't bring any advantage with transmogrification since some classes got a weapon type specs and weapon type perks within either class or talent trees. Same for armor. Rogue might look like he's wearing all those spell based gear or just have it transmogged to take advantage of your falsely based actions… Therefore type restrictions are necessary.

A human pirate runs at you; what race, class, and type of gear is it?

[Qixel]

As for the argument that you don't have proficiency to use those things properly, that's fine. A mage transmogging their robe into armor is not getting higher armor or anything. It's literally illusion magic to make your stuff look like other stuff. Under the illusion, it's still a robe, doing robe things. Pretending that the mace you're holding is a sword does not make it a sword.

[Sinrek]

Back on the topic though. Restrictions on weapon type are absolutely in line with PvP, lore and gameplay reasons. PvP shouldn't bring any advantage with transmogrification since some classes got a weapon type specs and weapon type perks within either class or talent trees. Same for armor. Rogue might look like he's wearing all those spell based gear or just have it transmogged to take advantage of your falsely based actions… Therefore type restrictions are necessary.

A human pirate runs at you; what race, class, and type of gear is it?

Well then. Let's take some analysis then.
First - you have an in-game tooltip for mouseover which will show you race, class, level (if not more than 20 over yours) and some addons might even show if this player is already targeting you or not.
Second - his weapons will still be visible despite the illusion that explicit item provides.
Third - with enough experience and observation you could even gauge the build your opponent is using, unless some advanced macros and addons are in play to conceal certain info on this.

Overall, as you see, this one is a bit incorrect as an example.

[Aubreykun]

I don't agree that players should be restricted from transmogrifying gear into something their class can't technically wear.

The purpose behind this is for server health. Many items share a model and it can be a factor towards pushing the needle in the unhealthy loot competition direction. You know, the old ""that's a hunter weapon"" type. It's something to consider because TWoW's population grows. Slowly, but it grows.

Items that do not share a category but do share a model can alleviate this by staggering the need-desires across the classes. It also encourages the creation of alts if you say, want to make a specific look. Either as "the same lore-character" using addons such as MyRoleplay to change your display name, or as a new individual altogether. Since your position is that game mechanics aren't related to lore, then by extension the playable game character itself is just a pawn - a representation of the "actual character."

PvP shouldn't bring any advantage with transmogrification since some classes got a weapon type specs and weapon type perks within either class or talent trees. Same for armor. Rogue might look like he's wearing all those spell based gear or just have it transmogged to take advantage of your falsely based actions… Therefore type restrictions are necessary.

While I'm in favor of the restrictions, this line of logic is already broken by having mogging in at all, since PvPers who really want to squeeze every strategic advantage out of things will mog their gear to look worse. Like a 60 making his stuff look like a collection of what he had at first ding (greens and blues) rather than blues/purples.

I do agree that the deviate fish and noggenfogger effects aren't as advantageous as it may seem though, for the reasons you stated. Plus, one death pops it and you'll be burning gold for uptime on it.

[Qixel]

Back on the topic though. Restrictions on weapon type are absolutely in line with PvP, lore and gameplay reasons. PvP shouldn't bring any advantage with transmogrification since some classes got a weapon type specs and weapon type perks within either class or talent trees. Same for armor. Rogue might look like he's wearing all those spell based gear or just have it transmogged to take advantage of your falsely based actions… Therefore type restrictions are necessary.

A human pirate runs at you; what race, class, and type of gear is it?

Well then. Let's take some analysis then.
First - you have an in-game tooltip for mouseover which will show you race, class, level (if not more than 20 over yours) and some addons might even show if this player is already targeting you or not.
Second - his weapons will still be visible despite the illusion that explicit item provides.
Third - with enough experience and observation you could even gauge the build your opponent is using, unless some advanced macros and addons are in play to conceal certain info on this.

Overall, as you see, this one is a bit incorrect as an example.

Let's reframe it, then. "A human in a robe and a mace runs at you; what race, class, and type of gear is it?"

First - you have an in-game tooltip for mouseover which will show you race, class, level (if not more than 10 over yours) and baseline game functions even show if this player is already targeting you or not. It reveals the player to be a human rogue named Zoomer.
Second - his weapon will still be visible despite the robe they appear to be wearing. As he engages you in combat, he puts on his real weapons, two swords.
Third - with enough experience and observation you could even gauge the build your opponent is using, unless some advanced macros and addons are in play to conceal certain info on this. And with this server being smaller, everyone knows who everyone is, and knows that Zoomer is a human rogue using swords. And for those you don't know yet, you can look them up on the armory to see exactly what they're wearing.

You're right, it really doesn't seem like a problem. No reason to stop it, then.

[Mac]

Not all illusions in the game display weapons and shields properly. For instance, the Succubus illusion doesn't display weapons. It can't. The model uses a whip that can't be removed without extensively editing the model itself. So yes, illusions can hide both the armor and weapons your characters wear and use.

The advantage you're scared transmogrification might give players in PVP can already be obtained through a turtle store bought illusion.

[Leoff]

^ just to add above, the xmog we have right now can be used to downplay gear in pvp if the player chooses to dress outside of the high rank gear. You’d still see that the r14 warrior is using two swords, but they might be low lv models skinned over high level weapons.

We should keep in mind that certain weapon types do have talent specific effects, like maces causing a stun chance for rogues or even disguising an ambush spec build by turning daggers into something else.

Idk the ins and outs of the xmog system, but maybe disable weapon xmog in pvp if it’s the major conflicting factor? I support Qixels idea of more freedom personally, from an rp perspective at least.

[Sinrek]

A human pirate runs at you; what race, class, and type of gear is it?

Well then. Let's take some analysis then.
First - you have an in-game tooltip for mouseover which will show you race, class, level (if not more than 20 over yours) and some addons might even show if this player is already targeting you or not.
Second - his weapons will still be visible despite the illusion that explicit item provides.
Third - with enough experience and observation you could even gauge the build your opponent is using, unless some advanced macros and addons are in play to conceal certain info on this.


Overall, as you see, this one is a bit incorrect as an example.

You're right, it really doesn't seem like a problem. No reason to stop it, then.

Let's not frame anything and flip things out. You're overcoomplicating things.

You like to conceal your superior gear before your enemies for whatever reason? Use Deviate which's already existing for your PvP pleasure.

There's no reason to implement another patch explicitly for this when you have the fish.

[Qixel]

Believe it or not, some of us joined this RP-PVE server because it was the only server that wasn't PVP. I'll admit that I'm a bit short tempered as a result of shutting down the same tired nonsense "but muh pvp!" argument again (even just in this thread alone!), but I definitely didn't anticipate being accused of wanting transmog because of pvp. I'll give you credit for originality, even if it's the most bizarrely off-base thing I've been accused of in a long while.

[Allwynd01]

Believe it or not, some of us joined this RP-PVE server because it was the only server that wasn't PVP. I'll admit that I'm a bit short tempered as a result of shutting down the same tired nonsense "but muh pvp!" argument again (even just in this thread alone!), but I definitely didn't anticipate being accused of wanting transmog because of pvp. I'll give you credit for originality, even if it's the most bizarrely off-base thing I've been accused of in a long while.

I agree with you. The fact that PvP took a more major spotlight on the server is not a good thing. I don't condemn it, but being a RP server is what drove me as well, even though I never RP in like pretending to be my character or talking like I'm live in Azeroth. I just enjoy the straying from the default (Blizzlike), which every other WoW private server touts as something that's a good thing.

The things that make Turtle stand out from other servers is what I like about it and why I'm here and not on some other server, especially the other popular Vanilla+ server, which mainly focuses on classes and abilities - thing that mean very little to me.

I don't agree that players should be restricted from transmogrifying gear into something their class can't technically wear.

The purpose behind this is for server health. Many items share a model and it can be a factor towards pushing the needle in the unhealthy loot competition direction. You know, the old ""that's a hunter weapon"" type. It's something to consider because TWoW's population grows. Slowly, but it grows.

Items that do not share a category but do share a model can alleviate this by staggering the need-desires across the classes. It also encourages the creation of alts if you say, want to make a specific look. Either as "the same lore-character" using addons such as MyRoleplay to change your display name, or as a new individual altogether. Since your position is that game mechanics aren't related to lore, then by extension the playable game character itself is just a pawn - a representation of the "actual character."

PvP shouldn't bring any advantage with transmogrification since some classes got a weapon type specs and weapon type perks within either class or talent trees. Same for armor. Rogue might look like he's wearing all those spell based gear or just have it transmogged to take advantage of your falsely based actions… Therefore type restrictions are necessary.

While I'm in favor of the restrictions, this line of logic is already broken by having mogging in at all, since PvPers who really want to squeeze every strategic advantage out of things will mog their gear to look worse. Like a 60 making his stuff look like a collection of what he had at first ding (greens and blues) rather than blues/purples.

I do agree that the deviate fish and noggenfogger effects aren't as advantageous as it may seem though, for the reasons you stated. Plus, one death pops it and you'll be burning gold for uptime on it.

Transmogrification is just a means for players to express themselves as they like and limiting it for stupid reasons is also quite stupid. ESO probably has the best transmogrification in MMORPGs (called Outfits) - you can make yourself look like you're wearing whatever gear you've made contact with. The fact that ESO doesn't have gear type restriction on its classes is not something that should limit it in WoW. Especially on Turtle where it should be all about giving players alternative means to enjoy the game.

The arguments that you can't tell what class a character is because they are masking it is also very close minded and bigoted, because it just means that people who only play one game absolutely refuse to adapt to any sort of change, regardless of whether it affects them in any way or not. So what if you don't know what class your enemy is at first sight? He is still an enemy and that's all that's important. Besides requiring to know what class everyone is at first sight is like admitting you want everything to have labels because you refuse to use your brain.

[Sinrek]

Believe it or not, some of us joined this RP-PVE server because it was the only server that wasn't PVP. I'll admit that I'm a bit short tempered as a result of shutting down the same tired nonsense "but muh pvp!" argument again (even just in this thread alone!), but I definitely didn't anticipate being accused of wanting transmog because of pvp. I'll give you credit for originality, even if it's the most bizarrely off-base thing I've been accused of in a long while.

Same for me, my friend. I'd be the first to sign any petition to Torta for removing this cursed Warmode (or at least the XP boost bonus from it) altogether.

You know it.

[Ugoboom]

Back on the topic though. Restrictions on weapon type are absolutely in line with PvP, lore and gameplay reasons. PvP shouldn't bring any advantage with transmogrification since some classes got a weapon type specs and weapon type perks within either class or talent trees. Same for armor. Rogue might look like he's wearing all those spell based gear or just have it transmogged to take advantage of your falsely based actions… Therefore type restrictions are necessary.

If this is the case, please remove noggenfogger and deviate delights from PVP, and remove any and all armor transmog. I can currently xmog my t3 into looking like t0 fresh 60 clown armor, and fake a player into thinking I'm not statted up.

But the staff won't, because that's silly, and so is your argument. The only weapon spec that actually has significant gameplay difference is mace spec, and the moment you get hit with a stun with the mace icon debuff, youll remember that guy has mace spec active and you'll just remember that of the guy. and it's not an issue at all. Sword axe and polearm spec don't really change how you approach and deal with a player, all 3 are capable of a low % chance of high burst. People will just prepare for the worst and expect sword spec, and all is fine. These are all tiny tiny implications in PVP that you are defending for massive disappointment for PVE and RPers.

I know it's a big ask for the technical implementation, but I'd settle for xmog disabled in PVP.

Just, whatever it takes, let the people enhance their enjoyment of RP and PVE, please, just as we were able to do 1.5 years ago.

The advantage you're scared transmogrification might give players in PVP can already be obtained through a turtle store bought illusion.

Illusions don't work in PVP, this isnt a good argument unfortunately

[Sinrek]

Back on the topic though. Restrictions on weapon type are absolutely in line with PvP, lore and gameplay reasons. PvP shouldn't bring any advantage with transmogrification since some classes got a weapon type specs and weapon type perks within either class or talent trees. Same for armor. Rogue might look like he's wearing all those spell based gear or just have it transmogged to take advantage of your falsely based actions… Therefore type restrictions are necessary.

If this is the case, please remove noggenfogger and deviate delights from PVP, and remove any and all armor transmog. I can currently xmog my t3 into looking like t0 fresh 60 clown armor, and fake a player into thinking I'm not statted up.

But the staff won't, because that's silly, and so is your argument. The only weapon spec that actually has significant gameplay difference is mace spec, and the moment you get hit with a stun with the mace icon debuff, youll remember that guy has mace spec active and you'll just remember that of the guy. and it's not an issue at all. Sword axe and polearm spec don't really change how you approach and deal with a player, all 3 are capable of a low % chance of high burst. People will just prepare for the worst and expect sword spec, and all is fine. These are all tiny tiny implications in PVP that you are defending for massive disappointment for PVE and RPers.

I know it's a big ask for the technical implementation, but I'd settle for xmog disabled in PVP.

Just, whatever it takes, let the people enhance their enjoyment of RP and PVE, please, just as we were able to do 1.5 years ago.

The advantage you're scared transmogrification might give players in PVP can already be obtained through a turtle store bought illusion.

Illusions don't work in PVP, this isnt a good argument unfortunately

peepoThonk

Perhaps it'd be more viable to make all morph disabled for PvP tagged players then, eh?

[Valadorn]

Back on the topic though. Restrictions on weapon type are absolutely in line with PvP, lore and gameplay reasons. PvP shouldn't bring any advantage with transmogrification since some classes got a weapon type specs and weapon type perks within either class or talent trees. Same for armor. Rogue might look like he's wearing all those spell based gear or just have it transmogged to take advantage of your falsely based actions… Therefore type restrictions are necessary.

If this is the case, please remove noggenfogger and deviate delights from PVP, and remove any and all armor transmog. I can currently xmog my t3 into looking like t0 fresh 60 clown armor, and fake a player into thinking I'm not statted up.

But the staff won't, because that's silly, and so is your argument. The only weapon spec that actually has significant gameplay difference is mace spec, and the moment you get hit with a stun with the mace icon debuff, youll remember that guy has mace spec active and you'll just remember that of the guy. and it's not an issue at all. Sword axe and polearm spec don't really change how you approach and deal with a player, all 3 are capable of a low % chance of high burst. People will just prepare for the worst and expect sword spec, and all is fine. These are all tiny tiny implications in PVP that you are defending for massive disappointment for PVE and RPers.

I know it's a big ask for the technical implementation, but I'd settle for xmog disabled in PVP.

Just, whatever it takes, let the people enhance their enjoyment of RP and PVE, please, just as we were able to do 1.5 years ago.

The advantage you're scared transmogrification might give players in PVP can already be obtained through a turtle store bought illusion.

Illusions don't work in PVP, this isnt a good argument unfortunately

peepoThonk

Perhaps it'd be more viable to make all morph disabled for PvP tagged players then, eh?

PvP players like to look cool too, tho :(

[Mac]

Illusions don't work in PVP, this isnt a good argument unfortunately

Are they disabled in battlegrounds? Because illusions definitely work in world PVP.

[Ugoboom]

Illusions don't work in PVP, this isnt a good argument unfortunately

Are they disabled in battlegrounds? Because illusions definitely work in world PVP.

yep. obviously Wpvp isnt of any concern to actually balance at all, it is purely organic, so illusions, an ideal unrestricted xmog, anything else should be totally valid there

[Dokkababecallme]

This problem exists for people who end up with a sword designated Mainhand and onehand, those two won't let you xmog over eachother even though they are identical in model usage!

Agreed, this one's bizarre. Look at Dal'Rend's arms: the mainhand and offhand are identical except for colour. Under the current transmog system, they're completely different types from each other, and incompatible with onehand swords.

The durability reset thing is annoying too, so hopefully that gets fixed eventually.

[Qixel]

Bumping for awareness. I've seen a couple threads pop up in regards to few things I addressed, so I figured it'd be worth pushing this back up.

[Highlordxenu]

The fact that you can't transmog vests to robes and back again - ITEMS IN THE SAME CATEGORY - is ridiculous!

[Coun]

The fact that you can't transmog vests to robes and back again - ITEMS IN THE SAME CATEGORY - is ridiculous!

As far as I'm aware that is not an intentional choice, but a technical limitation.

[Qixel]

I can confirm that you were able to transmog non-robes to robes under the old system. I was running a native robe on my warrior.