Shadow Priest Talent tree change suggestions

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Keds
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Shadow Priest Talent tree change suggestions

Post by Keds » Thu Jul 03, 2025 6:24 pm

One of the biggest problems with shadow priest tree is that it lacks a useful first row talent in the late game PvE wise after level 60, so with this in mind I propose some needed changes to help priest in PvE while Also considering it's PvP to not over buff it.

Image

- Improved Mind Blast moved to the first row.
Increases the talent usability without inferring in other aspects, this talent could also have a buff for early 60s since Mind Blast on CD is very mana intensive, so maybe giving it a effect that reads:
"and after successfully landing, restores 10/20/30/40/50% of the mana spent."
or
"If it resists, restores 10/20/30/40/50% of the mana spent."
But just moving it up would already be a good change.

- Shadow Focus.
Reduces your target's chance to resist your Shadow spells by 2/4/6/8/10% and gives you a 5/10/15/20/25% chance to avoid interruption caused by damage while casting Shadow spells. (Now has additional 25% chance to avoid interruption while casting shadow spells because Shadow lacks ANY pushback reduction, would also be nice since the priest max cast range now would be 30 yards, more on this below.)

- Changed Shadow Reach to Improved Mind Flay.
Increases the range of your Mind Flay spell by 5/10 yards, but reduces its slow by 10/20%. (Now its 30 yards, just like all the other priest spells, to compensate this, it also has a drawback that reduces the slow so it doesn't affect the PvP aspect. This still would make shadow priest a "lesser caster" since all the others would have 36 yards with their respective talents, but it would increase the overall range by 6 yards since mind flay would be 30 as well.)

- Improved Mana Burn.
Reduces the casting time of your Mana Burn spell by 0.25/0.5 sec and increases the amount of Mana burnt by 5/10%. (A pvp talent, that got a buff that increases its mana burnt by 5/10% to compensate the loss of 6 yards on other spells in PvP.)

-Added Shadow Nova.
Causes an explosion around the caster, causing 86 to 99 Shadow damage to the caster and to all enemy targets within 10 yards, and heals all party members within 10 yards for 50 to 59. (Because using Holy Nova in Shadow Form feels wrong and putting points into the holy tree feels terrible, as shadow doesn't benefit from basically anything. This change make it so it benefits from the shadow talent tree as well, Shadow Nova also damages more and heal less, the opposite of Holy Nova.)

-Shadow Weaving now has 3 ranks.
Your single target Shadow damage spells have a 33/66/100% chance to cause your target to be vulnerable to Shadow damage. This vulnerability increases the Shadow damage dealt to your target by 3% and lasts 15 sec. Stacks up to 5 times. (This is mostly because some people are using (4/5) points on this talent, which I don't think it feels good, and also opens up the possibility of eventually adding a new talent on the tree without increase the total point on the tree too much).

Talents Ideas:

Pain Devourer or Painspeaker (2/2):
Reduces the cooldown of Pain Spike by 14/28 seconds but Pain Spike costs health instead of mana. (I like the idea that shadow priest has self sustain, and making it so this spell damages the priest makes a nice synergy with it's theme, also, I like using this spell to TRY to proc Spirit Tap in raid trash mobs, but with 40 seconds of cooldown makes this very hard.)

Surge of Shadows (1/1):
While in Shadowform, casting speed increase effects increases the tick speed of your damage over time spells and the tick speed of your Mind Flay, reducing it's duration. (The idea here is to make shadow priests benefit from haste like all other casters, this is even more important here since shadow priests doesn't benefit from crit as much as other classes.)

This is not on the shadow tree itself, but, If we were to make Silent Resolve (disc tree) twice as powerful for shadows spells, we could remove Shadow Affinity, reducing the redundancy for shadow priests.
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Keds
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Re: Shadow Priest Talent tree change suggestions

Post by Keds » Fri Jul 04, 2025 12:24 pm

Would love to hear your suggestions and/or improvements!
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Re: Shadow Priest Talent tree change suggestions

Post by Keds » Sat Jul 05, 2025 11:16 pm

Bumpp
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Ashton007
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Re: Shadow Priest Talent tree change suggestions

Post by Ashton007 » Mon Jul 07, 2025 4:59 am

It’s a bit over complicated. shadow really just needs a cheaper route to get to holy nova and spiritual giudance without wasting talent points on worthless things that do not benefit shadow. Having the aoe and extra spellpower should be normalized but building for that actually feels like shit, because you pick up those useless talents. They almost cooked though.

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Re: Shadow Priest Talent tree change suggestions

Post by Keds » Mon Jul 07, 2025 11:37 am

Ashton007 wrote: Mon Jul 07, 2025 4:59 am It’s a bit over complicated. shadow really just needs a cheaper route to get to holy nova and spiritual giudance without wasting talent points on worthless things that do not benefit shadow. Having the aoe and extra spellpower should be normalized but building for that actually feels like shit, because you pick up those useless talents. They almost cooked though.
I do agree that putting points into holy feels terrible, that why I'm suggestion the Shadow Nova counterpart, but I do think it's better to just add a Shadow Nova than changing most early talents from the Holy tree to better fit shadow the shadow spec, these trees are the opposite of the other, and forcing us to put talents onto a tree that has zero benefit to our main role to be able able to get our ONLY AOE is a bad idea.
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Re: Shadow Priest Talent tree change suggestions

Post by Atreidon » Mon Jul 07, 2025 1:27 pm

One thing i dont understand tho, why does shadow priest need a good aoe to function in his role as a utility dps caster?

You have multidotting swp for mobs that last long and for mobs that dont, your group got you. And if you REALLY want a AoE the option with holy nova is there for the taking

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Re: Shadow Priest Talent tree change suggestions

Post by Keds » Mon Jul 07, 2025 1:55 pm

Atreidon wrote: Mon Jul 07, 2025 1:27 pm One thing i dont understand tho, why does shadow priest need a good aoe to function in his role as a utility dps caster?

You have multidotting swp for mobs that last long and for mobs that dont, your group got you. And if you REALLY want a AoE the option with holy nova is there for the taking
Well, since the damage increase from CC2, multydotting is very expensive mana wise, while also being very little effective since things dies too quickly, also, casting VE on that single trash so you can actually benefit your party also sucks for the same reasons.
The fact that they enabled Shadow Priests to be able to use Holy Nova means theres a problem there, but their solution feels bad to get to.
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Ashton007
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Re: Shadow Priest Talent tree change suggestions

Post by Ashton007 » Mon Jul 07, 2025 2:20 pm

Atreidon wrote: Mon Jul 07, 2025 1:27 pm One thing i dont understand tho, why does shadow priest need a good aoe to function in his role as a utility dps caster?

You have multidotting swp for mobs that last long and for mobs that dont, your group got you. And if you REALLY want a AoE the option with holy nova is there for the taking
Holy nova isn’t “good aoe”, it’s like a discount arcane explosion. And spreading dots is highly mana inefficient. The problem is that they tried to put it “there for the taking” but you lose a lot to gain quite little. They put it there intentionally for us to use but then the build doesn’t make sense and a large chunk of the talent points are wasted. It’s just a bad design.

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Re: Shadow Priest Talent tree change suggestions

Post by Atreidon » Mon Jul 07, 2025 4:14 pm

Ashton007 wrote: Mon Jul 07, 2025 2:20 pm
Atreidon wrote: Mon Jul 07, 2025 1:27 pm One thing i dont understand tho, why does shadow priest need a good aoe to function in his role as a utility dps caster?

You have multidotting swp for mobs that last long and for mobs that dont, your group got you. And if you REALLY want a AoE the option with holy nova is there for the taking
Holy nova isn’t “good aoe”, it’s like a discount arcane explosion. And spreading dots is highly mana inefficient. The problem is that they tried to put it “there for the taking” but you lose a lot to gain quite little. They put it there intentionally for us to use but then the build doesn’t make sense and a large chunk of the talent points are wasted. It’s just a bad design.
Which leaves the question, why is shadow priest in particular in need of a buff to his aoe capabilities/ a removal of all the downsides of his aoe?

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Re: Shadow Priest Talent tree change suggestions

Post by Keds » Mon Jul 07, 2025 5:44 pm

Atreidon wrote: Mon Jul 07, 2025 4:14 pm
Which leaves the question, why is shadow priest in particular in need of a buff to his aoe capabilities/ a removal of all the downsides of his aoe?
Well, since they added a casting time in VE, in trash mobs now we hardly use it, and if we do, it's benefit is almost non-existent, so it leave us with the option to multidot, that again, with the damage increase across all classes, mobs dies too fast, and we just spend a lot of mana doing piratically nothing.

Holy Nova or Shadow Nova (as proposed) has it's own downside that damages the caster, also costs a lot of mana, but it would just make it worth it's cost. Isn't turtle philosophy to fix things that that didn't in classic, better?

I don't want to make it OP like arcane mages Arcane Explosion, but SPriests took a hit from the VE casting time in CC2, this change didn't affect only the PvP aspect of it, also took away our trash mob clean speed.... They tried to remedy this with Holy Nova but forcing us to be just as efficient but having to take useless talents for our main role is terrible, no one asked for this.
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Terrydavis
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Re: Shadow Priest Talent tree change suggestions

Post by Terrydavis » Mon Jul 07, 2025 9:23 pm

priest is the worst class on turtle wow for many, many reasons. this wont change, probably ever. i could make you a long list but theres no point. just trust me. if you want to have fun / compete you need to play some other class. the past patches demonstrate very nicely that no one gives a fuck.

people have posted the same issues a million times but theres no one who could care.

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