Hamstring nerf was unnecessary and is a huge deal

[Gladius]

Me, another warrior and a druid were farming Zul'Mamwe troll ruins in STV. Another druid 3-4 levels lower than us harassed the shit out of us with moonfire and range. Would hit us when we were fighting troll and panther packs.

Shapeshifted right out of our hamstrings the 3 or 4 times he made a mistake and came in our Intercept range. Managed to escape every time. Only once did he need to use a grenade (probably an engineer).

Why does warrior's hamstring have a CD when druid's shapeshift does not?! That does not make sense. I understand that warriors have high damage but warriors in pvp 1v1 are not overpowered. Just do a flat out 10% or even 20% damage reduction if you want to but do not take away the small amount of mobility that warriors have.


Today I got camped by a hunter. I managed to kill him twice when he made a lot of mistakes (out of 8 times) but 30 seconds CD on intercept (which hunter's shots can also outrange) and Turtle wow's addition of 6 second CD on hamstring is absolutely insane and damning.

I'm not complaining on execute nerf. Just give us hamstring back. Some kind of real mobility (not the RNG Counterattack).

Also, warrior is not popular because of the purported reason that he is OP. Warrior is popular because its the only non-magical honorable (vs rogue) melee in classic. And has fun mechanics/rotation. Nerf the damage output if you are so concerned about warriors being OP. Dont nerf the mechanics and especially mobility mechanics please.

[Akos1896]

Did you imply that rogues are not honorable?!
Good points btw.
Hamstring CD was added because of WF proc fishing at PVE back then but it probably wasn't the best solution.

[Gelinho]

No, don't nerf the damage output

[Bigsmerf]

Warriors very much are popular because they're OP. If something could be popular because people liked the class/flavor fantasy we wouldn't have had full warrior stacked groups in every raid back in classic.

[Gladius]

I don't care about raids. Hamstring CD has nothing to do with raids. I'm talking about non-premade PVP.

Fucking basics.

[amanagor]

I don't care about raids. Hamstring CD has nothing to do with raids. I'm talking about non-premade PVP.

Fucking basics.

the problem is you give warrior a healer than they become OP; much more op than any other class with a healer. IF we gave them more utility it would just make warrior even more OP than it currently is.

[Bigsmerf]

Hamstring CD has nothing to do with raids.

Have you played the class?

Fucking basics, man.

[Turbosaxophonic]

Hamstring CD has nothing to do with raids.

Have you played the class?

Fucking basics, man.

Hamstring CD has nothing to do with raiding, Sunder Armor’s rage cost was reduced to fill the exact same role of fishing for procs. It was never a problematic play pattern and was specifically preserved in the class changes.

[Bigsmerf]

Hamstring CD has nothing to do with raids.

Have you played the class?

Fucking basics, man.

Hamstring CD has nothing to do with raiding, Sunder Armor’s rage cost was reduced to fill the exact same role of fishing for procs. It was never a problematic play pattern and was specifically preserved in the class changes.

I retract my previous statement, then.

[Zahnfee]

I might add that as a hc warrior your only early game escape tool is useless picture charging a mob, killing a mob having half hp and then another mob spawn near you and attack you or maybe another mob pathed to close to your location and you want to escape just to be safe because you havel only half hp left... i mean harmstring miss well gg go agane.

[Likaleo]

Just use piercing howl it has no cd and its aoe

[Zahnfee]

ya early game as in below 20 mind you hc warrior early game is the worst :D + u usually want to go arms spec first for the overpower damage so it will take a long time to get to piercing howl....

[Zulnam]

i just wanna point out that druid wpvp has always been peak druid pvp in vanilla. Druid's strongest point is kiting.

Odds are you wouldn't have had him pinned down even without hamstring cd nerf.

Not saying the nerf was justified. But i'd like to hear more end-game related opinions before forming one myself.

[Mozillarum]

Dear TurtleWow team,

I'm a first time twow enjoyer and long time classic/vanilla warrior fan. What made ARMS warrior fun in this setting was the fact we could fish for procs with Hamstring. Now that we have to rely on Sunder Armor to do so... it's a huge deal. We can easily pull aggro from our friends and no longer enjoy the "russian roulette" type of gameplay (which also requiered some rage management skills). And don't get me started with the "it's our only escape tool" topic...

Best regards,
Mozillarum

[Wolf of Rage]

Hamstring is also the only one that can proc Sword Specialization from Master of Arms.

Sunder cannot.

Applying Rend also cannot.

The nerfs to Hamstring go deeper than the surface level of what people typically argue.

[Taralej90]

Hamstring CD has nothing to do with raids.

Have you played the class?

Fucking basics, man.

Hamstring CD has nothing to do with raiding, Sunder Armor’s rage cost was reduced to fill the exact same role of fishing for procs. It was never a problematic play pattern and was specifically preserved in the class changes.

Are you sure Sunder Armor - a non-damaging ability - can proc WF? When Hamstring's damage was removed, it was done specifically so that it wouldn't trigger WF anymore.

The "fix" to vanilla Hamstring is extremely simple - remove the damage component. That's all.

[Bayanni]

The nerf is pretty certainly for pvp, which I feel was too ham-fisted and was a huge setback for warrior pvp. I'm not saying hamstring spam was good game design, but 6s is seriously restrictive. 3s or 4s cd would have been better imo as 6s might as well be forever in pvp.

[Wolf of Rage]

Nerf affects every area.

Leveling.

PvP.

PvE to an extent as well.

In essence, you have no Improved Hamstring - - Counterattack sucks, is costlier, shorter, and has fewer possible cases of use.

Sword Specialization can hardly be fished for.

Hand of Justice, anything else like it, and Windfury Totem fishing remain the same through Sunder instead, but it is damageless amongst other factors - - on top of not being able to fish for Crits to proc Deep Wounds and, more relatably here due to changes, certain new effects if you have them (Set Bonuses).

Everyone whosoever argues that it was deserved or that it's no big deal is merely baiting or missing every manner of clues as to just how important these blatant nerfs are, and ought to roll a Warrior, level without being boosted, do endgame PvE, and especially PvP - - otherwise, just shut up and complain about your Hybrid Class not having enough buffs.