Goblin Shamans - A Possibilty that fits in the Lore

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Reaver594
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Goblin Shamans - A Possibilty that fits in the Lore

Post by Reaver594 » Sun Oct 27, 2024 1:32 pm

Lets start with the Lore part:

Turtle wow missed out on a really cool opportunity of creating a special and unique questline, to make goblin shamans work.

Imagine you start your journey out on Blackstone island, a place were Nature, Earth and Water got exploited to the limit, until only a barren burned place was left. You spawn in as the normal level 1 Goblin (shaman), BUT during the first few quests (collect ash, wood, etc) a voice suddenly speaks to you, calling out for your help to save these lands.

Wondering what that was you ask around with the goblins but no one can tell you and some even laugh at you, calling you crazy. You start to believe it may have been a prank, or even something in the water tricking your mind, and go on with your life.

Until the voice appears again calling you towards sone hidden cave, where a rock elemental awaits to tell you about how the Elements have suffered here, and are in Broken and in Anger. The elemental sets you on a path to help calm, and soothe the elements pain and anger, and in so secret from the other Goblins, safe and sooth the little that’s left of Blackstone island.

This could all end in a final quest, where you prevent some elementals from uprising against the goblins, which would probably destroy themselves, kill many of your fellow goblins or even destroy blackstone Island. Then, a thankful Earth Elemental sends you on the path, to meet some Orc shaman in Durotar/Orgrimmar, that will watch and guide you on your future journey as Shaman of the Horde.

This is just one idea how it could work in a unique way, um sure there are many more. Goblins are very good ad adapting after all.


Now a few words about mechanics:

Horde has has historically a lower nunmber of possible heal/race combinations. Alliance has 8, Horde has 6 right now. I understand that the devs probably thought it fitting to make Goblin the one Horde race without Healers, similiar to Gnomes for the Alliance, but I think missed out on a oportunity to give Horde players another option for a Heal/race combination.

Alliance:............................vs......................Horde:
Nightelf: Druid, Priest.....................................Tauren: Druid, Shaman
Humans: Priest, Paladin...................................Orc: Shaman
Dwarfs: Priest, Paladin....................................Troll: Shaman, Priest
Gnome: none...............................................Goblin: none
High Elf: Priest: Paladin...................................Undead: Priest


On another Note - Number of playable classes per Factions: Adding Another Option to Horde would even out that field too.

Alliance:............................vs......................Horde:
Nightelf: 5..................................................Tauren: 4
Humans: 7..................................................Orc: 6
Dwarfs: 6...................................................Troll: 7
Gnome: 5...................................................Goblin: 5
High Elf: 6..................................................Undead: 6

= 29 = 28

Czasku
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Re: Goblin Shamans - A Possibilty that fits in the Lore

Post by Czasku » Sun Oct 27, 2024 5:24 pm

Two words: Tauren Rogues.
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Karrados
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Re: Goblin Shamans - A Possibilty that fits in the Lore

Post by Karrados » Sun Oct 27, 2024 7:07 pm

Afaik Horde has fewer everything if I remember correctly. Fewer Tanks, Heals and DPS. They had no problem adding Paladin to High Elves despite the fact that there is no mention of a High Elf Paladin anywhere in WC 3 or even Wow Vanilla.

Yes, there were High Elf Priests but Priests are NOT Paladins. The Paladin Order was made up entirely of Humans in WC 2 and 3 which also makes Dwarves a questionable choice but I understand that there have to be races for Race diversity.

My point is - If High Elves and Dwarves were able to learn how to handle the Light then what stops another Race on the Horde side to pick up the Shamanistic Arts?

Goblins are known to be able to adapt, you even posted a possible lore explanation for them - Can't exploit the land if there is no land left.

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Bigsmerf
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Re: Goblin Shamans - A Possibilty that fits in the Lore

Post by Bigsmerf » Mon Oct 28, 2024 12:23 am

No it doesn't lmao
Elmhoof - 60 Boomkin
Tacheka - 41 Melee hunter (Planned secondary main)
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Harkus
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Re: Goblin Shamans - A Possibilty that fits in the Lore

Post by Harkus » Mon Oct 28, 2024 9:29 am

Goblin shaman fits the lore just as well as night elf warlocks/mages or undead paladins... so not at all... Goblins are greedy bastards who relish destroying everything for profit, they would be crushed by earth elementals for defiling their lands, suffocated by air elementals for polluting their sky and drowned by water elementals for putrifiying their lakes if they tried communing with them happy_turtle_head

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Reploidrocsa
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Re: Goblin Shamans - A Possibilty that fits in the Lore

Post by Reploidrocsa » Mon Oct 28, 2024 10:34 am

It could fit for a unique NPC but not for an entire race to have its class. Remember, for a class to be playable it needs to be a common thing for that race, not a chosen type of thing.

Same for undead paladins, one or two chosen might make it work, but not the regular adventurer

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Re: Goblin Shamans - A Possibilty that fits in the Lore

Post by Akos1896 » Mon Oct 28, 2024 10:53 am

Shamans are a mirror of paladins.
If you give a 4th playable shaman race, a 4th playable paladin race should be added, too.
But adding paladins to nelves or gnomes would feel really weird.

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Karrados
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Re: Goblin Shamans - A Possibilty that fits in the Lore

Post by Karrados » Mon Oct 28, 2024 3:28 pm

Akos1896 wrote: Mon Oct 28, 2024 10:53 am Shamans are a mirror of paladins.
If you give a 4th playable shaman race, a 4th playable paladin race should be added, too.
But adding paladins to nelves or gnomes would feel really weird.

We can't apply the "Mirror" here when Alliance flat out has more choices for all of it. They have more Tanks and Healers and I don't remember DPS 100% but I am quite sure even there they are equal or have more options.

So if things are supposed to be mirrored then Horde needs more options -now-.

Templar85
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Re: Goblin Shamans - A Possibilty that fits in the Lore

Post by Templar85 » Mon Oct 28, 2024 4:02 pm

I don't think Goblin shamans are too lore friendly but Undead Paladins, Troll druids, Gnome priests are legit.

Even Tauren paladins can be an option but they need to rebrand, rename every single of paladin talents / spells / visuals to look more nature based instead of holly and calling the class anything but paladin. Like Ward of Nature or something.

If they add Ogre race they can have an unique talent tree which is a mix of other classes talent trees. Elemental tree from shaman (spells visuals can be shadow and void type instead of nature), Fury from warrior and Destruction from warlock. Not exactly the same trees but 70% similar to those.

Atreidon
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Re: Goblin Shamans - A Possibilty that fits in the Lore

Post by Atreidon » Mon Oct 28, 2024 4:10 pm

Templar85 wrote: Mon Oct 28, 2024 4:02 pm I don't think Goblin shamans are too lore friendly but Undead Paladins, Troll druids, Gnome priests are legit.

Even Tauren paladins can be an option but they need to rebrand, rename every single of paladin talents / spells / visuals to look more nature based instead of holly and calling the class anything but paladin. Like Ward of Nature or something.

If they add Ogre race they can have an unique talent tree which is a mix of other classes talent trees. Elemental tree from shaman (spells visuals can be shadow and void type instead of nature), Fury from warrior and Destruction from warlock. Not exactly the same trees but 70% similar to those.
Tauren paladin can be an option if its not paladin dead_turtle_head

Guillaume
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Re: Goblin Shamans - A Possibilty that fits in the Lore

Post by Guillaume » Mon Oct 28, 2024 4:17 pm

Karrados wrote: Mon Oct 28, 2024 3:28 pm
Akos1896 wrote: Mon Oct 28, 2024 10:53 am Shamans are a mirror of paladins.
If you give a 4th playable shaman race, a 4th playable paladin race should be added, too.
But adding paladins to nelves or gnomes would feel really weird.

We can't apply the "Mirror" here when Alliance flat out has more choices for all of it. They have more Tanks and Healers and I don't remember DPS 100% but I am quite sure even there they are equal or have more options.

So if things are supposed to be mirrored then Horde needs more options -now-.
Warrior - all (parity)
Hunter - all (parity)
Druid - nelf / tauren (parity)
Mage - human, dwarf, gnome, helf / orc, undead, troll, goblin (parity)
Paladin / Shaman - human, dwarf, nelf / orc, troll, tauren (parity)

Priest - human, dwarf, nelf, helf / undead, troll (+2 Alliance)
Warlock - human, gnome / orc, undead, troll, goblin (+2 Horde) (parity)

Rogue - human, dwarf, nelf, gnome, helf / orc, undead, troll, goblin (+1 Alliance)

The only class combination Horde is missing is Rogue. Thus if you are so preoccupied with balance, you should root for Tauren rogues.

Lorddandas
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Re: Goblin Shamans - A Possibilty that fits in the Lore

Post by Lorddandas » Mon Oct 28, 2024 7:15 pm

Harkus wrote: Mon Oct 28, 2024 9:29 am Goblin shaman fits the lore just as well as night elf warlocks/mages or undead paladins... so not at all... Goblins are greedy bastards who relish destroying everything for profit, they would be crushed by earth elementals for defiling their lands, suffocated by air elementals for polluting their sky and drowned by water elementals for putrifiying their lakes if they tried communing with them happy_turtle_head
Goblin Shamans do not really connect with the elements. They create mechanical devices that trap them and then they exploit them.

Akos1896
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Re: Goblin Shamans - A Possibilty that fits in the Lore

Post by Akos1896 » Mon Oct 28, 2024 7:24 pm

I can accept that but that's not shamanism. You can call it tinkering if we theorycraft a class or just engineering but using technology to enslave elements is not shamanism.

Lorddandas
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Re: Goblin Shamans - A Possibilty that fits in the Lore

Post by Lorddandas » Mon Oct 28, 2024 9:03 pm

Akos1896 wrote: Mon Oct 28, 2024 7:24 pm I can accept that but that's not shamanism. You can call it tinkering if we theorycraft a class or just engineering but using technology to enslave elements is not shamanism.
I think it´d be practically the same thing. In the same way Trolls canonically master every class with the help of loa without the players even realizing it. Goblins would master their class via this method.

Lorddandas
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Re: Goblin Shamans - A Possibilty that fits in the Lore

Post by Lorddandas » Mon Oct 28, 2024 9:09 pm

Akos1896 wrote: Mon Oct 28, 2024 10:53 am Shamans are a mirror of paladins.
If you give a 4th playable shaman race, a 4th playable paladin race should be added, too.
But adding paladins to nelves or gnomes would feel really weird.
But Shaman cannot be a proper tank unlike a paladin, no ? So they´re not really mirrors.

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