Hello, this is my first time playing as a hunter so I did some researching on the following issue and got the impression it isn't a skill problem, but a bug or a choice, so I'm wondering which of those applies: from my findings online the combo feign death + trap (often put in a macro) has been a standard tool for hunters since the early days of vanilla, and it was the first thing I came across when looking for tips on how to do PvP as a hunter given that fighting melee is basically guaranteed death (and just putting points in Survival so Deterrence becomes available isn't the silver bullet some make it out to be). Then I found out that seemed to always fail, so I did some more searching and found a table somewhere saying that when against players of your own level the failure rate of FD should be around 4%, with it skyrocketing once you faced those 3 levels or more higher than you, but my problem is it seemed to be failing 100% of the time, even against those lower level than me. Since I can't replicate it thousands of times to be sure, I started testing the FD+trap combo with training dummies and mobs out in the world, and it didn't work either. I saw people mentioning there was a delay, so I tested that with said mobs and dummies, just used FD and waited to see if traps became available, but they didn't. I also saw people mentioning the pet could be aggroing, so I tried it without a pet (both PvP and PvE) and it still didn't work. Then I came across a ton of people complaining about it in Blizzard forums regarding that very issue in Classic (the first Classic, before TBC Classic), and quite a few of them were talking about how they played hunters in vanilla and that wasn't an issue (that is, they could cast FD and then trap in PvP or elsewhere), they even posted some videos. So my question here is whether this is a bug, like it was in Classic, or a feature.
Here's an example of the mentioned discussions regarding Classic, although there are others:
https://us.forums.blizzard.com/en/wow/t ... bug/278131
https://classic.wowhead.com/news/hunter ... ess-295293
FD + trap in PvP/combat
Re: FD + trap in PvP/combat
Well it works 100% of the times for lamara and he keeps beating me in pvp because of it.
Maybe he can teach you
Maybe he can teach you
Re: FD + trap in PvP/combat
There are several problems and bugs for the FD and the trap.
Before specifying my details, I want to let you know that I have been playing hunt since 2009 and I have been beta tested for daemon and viper for those who know (the admins of Nostalrius Beta and Begins.), I am more commonly known under the pseudonym of Kaszia.
Bugs:
1) Sometimes when the pet takes physical damage, it keeps us in combat or brings us back into combat, while the entry and exit of combat for the hunter and his pet are interdependent. (It causes big problems when we try FD+trap) It's part of a general problem too, when we're out of combat, when we eat to regen, but our pet or the group makes us go into combat, we don't regen anymore, although we continue to eat, normally it doesn't happen. don't go like this
2) When we execute FD and we rotate the camera to the left or to the right (right click) it lifts us up immediately, except it's not supposed to lift us up, suddenly it produces an entry into direct combat.
3) The trap is not supposed to have a slight activation delay, it must be instantaneous, even if a war is charging us.
Because to put you in situation; a trap set in front of us, if a war charges us and at the time to put an automatic attack + a knee breaker (especially if it is end game stuff), it's over.
Except this is not supposed to be the case and the trap should activate instantly.
4) Traps can be resisted in pvp, but on the other hand the FD is not supposed to be resisted in PVP.
The talent point that reduces resist FD is useful for PVE.
5) to be checked, but it seems to me that our character is totally out of combat when the FD animation ends, which is not advantageous for those who have a long death animation.
Normally we go out of combat as soon as the spell is activated.
These are the major problems I encountered on the FD + TRAP.
Of course my expertise is based on wow vanilla of the time, on various sources, memories and old videos, which unfortunately the more time passes, the more they are likely to be deleted from you tube.
I have other bugs to report for the hunt. But this thread deals with the FD + TRAP
Before specifying my details, I want to let you know that I have been playing hunt since 2009 and I have been beta tested for daemon and viper for those who know (the admins of Nostalrius Beta and Begins.), I am more commonly known under the pseudonym of Kaszia.
Bugs:
1) Sometimes when the pet takes physical damage, it keeps us in combat or brings us back into combat, while the entry and exit of combat for the hunter and his pet are interdependent. (It causes big problems when we try FD+trap) It's part of a general problem too, when we're out of combat, when we eat to regen, but our pet or the group makes us go into combat, we don't regen anymore, although we continue to eat, normally it doesn't happen. don't go like this
2) When we execute FD and we rotate the camera to the left or to the right (right click) it lifts us up immediately, except it's not supposed to lift us up, suddenly it produces an entry into direct combat.
3) The trap is not supposed to have a slight activation delay, it must be instantaneous, even if a war is charging us.
Because to put you in situation; a trap set in front of us, if a war charges us and at the time to put an automatic attack + a knee breaker (especially if it is end game stuff), it's over.
Except this is not supposed to be the case and the trap should activate instantly.
4) Traps can be resisted in pvp, but on the other hand the FD is not supposed to be resisted in PVP.
The talent point that reduces resist FD is useful for PVE.
5) to be checked, but it seems to me that our character is totally out of combat when the FD animation ends, which is not advantageous for those who have a long death animation.
Normally we go out of combat as soon as the spell is activated.
These are the major problems I encountered on the FD + TRAP.
Of course my expertise is based on wow vanilla of the time, on various sources, memories and old videos, which unfortunately the more time passes, the more they are likely to be deleted from you tube.
I have other bugs to report for the hunt. But this thread deals with the FD + TRAP
Re: FD + trap in PvP/combat
Good to see I'm not crazy, then. I'm happy that there were quick replies, but as I wasn't expecting it I returned to the thread due to some additional info: I went into Arathi Basin to test it yet again and for the first time ever it worked, except I did it manually (which I had also done before but hadn't worked for some reason, and this time I didn't even have time to recall the pet manually, so maybe it was luck?). Afterwards I got a friend to test it in a duel and when doing things slowly it seems to work (that is, we're fighting, then I tell my pet to follow - already have it on passive -, feign death and then finally setting a trap is an option, although it seemed like sometimes there was a delay and at others there wasn't), I tested it both with and without the pet. Then theoretically the problem would be with the macros (although I tried a bunch of different ones I found online), but given my experience has not been consistent and you've explained more detailed issues than I have then maybe there really is something else to it.
Re: FD + trap in PvP/combat
Since the beginning of vanilla private servers, you should know that the hunter is the most complicated class to script by far.
It is too complex.
Important detail that nobody knows anymore and at the time nobody knew this trick.
But normally the FD works like a vanish, that is to say that if we are sent a fireball or other and we activate FD during its flight, the FD acts like a vanish and we "avoid" the spell.
Only Nostalrius had reproduced this exactly like the vanilla of the time.
It is too complex.
Important detail that nobody knows anymore and at the time nobody knew this trick.
But normally the FD works like a vanish, that is to say that if we are sent a fireball or other and we activate FD during its flight, the FD acts like a vanish and we "avoid" the spell.
Only Nostalrius had reproduced this exactly like the vanilla of the time.
Re: FD + trap in PvP/combat
Hey,
This is the macro I use and it works 90% of the time.
Note, if you have a sting active it might put you back in combat between pressing twice. Unlikely but possible.
I didn't invent this macro, credits go to Raziya. Link https://forum.nostalrius.org/viewtopic.php?f=38&t=21017
Good luck hunting!
Vliqta
This is the macro I use and it works 90% of the time.
/cast Freezing Trap
/script if UnitAffectingCombat("player") then CastSpellByName("Feign Death") end
/script if UnitExists("pettarget") and CheckInteractDistance("target", 3) and UnitIsUnit("target", "pettarget") then PetPassiveMode(); else end
You need to press this macro twice quickly cause you're are doing two spells in essence, feign death and trap./script if UnitAffectingCombat("player") then CastSpellByName("Feign Death") end
/script if UnitExists("pettarget") and CheckInteractDistance("target", 3) and UnitIsUnit("target", "pettarget") then PetPassiveMode(); else end
Note, if you have a sting active it might put you back in combat between pressing twice. Unlikely but possible.
I didn't invent this macro, credits go to Raziya. Link https://forum.nostalrius.org/viewtopic.php?f=38&t=21017
Good luck hunting!
Vliqta
Re: FD + trap in PvP/combat
Nothing to do, we're not talking about that, we're talking about a real bug, light but the details make the difference.Vliqta wrote: ↑Wed Oct 05, 2022 5:49 pmHey,
This is the macro I use and it works 90% of the time.
/cast Freezing TrapYou need to press this macro twice quickly cause you're are doing two spells in essence, feign death and trap.
/script if UnitAffectingCombat("player") then CastSpellByName("Feign Death") end
/script if UnitExists("pettarget") and CheckInteractDistance("target", 3) and UnitIsUnit("target", "pettarget") then PetPassiveMode(); else end
Note, if you have a sting active it might put you back in combat between pressing twice. Unlikely but possible.
I didn't invent this macro, credits go to Raziya. Link https://forum.nostalrius.org/viewtopic.php?f=38&t=21017
Good luck hunting!
Vliqta
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Gladeshadow
- Posts: 178
Re: FD + trap in PvP/combat
On a potentially related note, I've noticed the Gnomish Cloaking device, an engineering item, that provides the user with invisibility in combat (until an action is taken) and should drop combat also fail in pve. This was ensuring the device was used with autoattacking off. It might be that feign death and the cloaking device are both missing whatever coding makes a rogue's vanish work. Looking into that could potentially work on the development side.
Re: FD + trap in PvP/combat
and after FD - u have to get up before trap. Maybe its a bug but under FD u have only one notice "not enough mana". So it makes some macros unusable