what Country is Turtle wow based in? and how hard would it be for Blizzard to shut us down?

[Diademuertos]

I was wondering what Country Turtle wow is based out of and how hard it would be for Blizzard to shut the server down if they ever decided to go after it

i know Blizzard has offices and legal departments across the world including America, Europe and Asia so I am wondering if Turtle wow is based in a country where Blizzard cant get to them or what their chances would be of winning if they got ordered to shut the server down

[Siinda]

It's in Europe which means property that is no longer updated and maintained by the creator becomes equally the consumers. Very different from US law where copyright is almost lifelong and we are essentially renting our character accounts from Blizz.

[Diademuertos]

It's in Europe which means property that is no longer updated and maintained by the creator becomes equally the consumers. Very different from US law where copyright is almost lifelong and we are essentially renting our character accounts from Blizz.

well Nostalrius was based in Europe as well and yet the server got shut down by Blizzard's legal goons

if property that is no longer updated or maintained becomes the consumers then how was Blizzard able to get Nostalrius shut down?

[Mrkrissatan]

well Nostalrius was based in Europe as well and yet the server got shut down by Blizzard's legal goons

if property that is no longer updated or maintained becomes the consumers then how was Blizzard able to get Nostalrius shut down?

I think the key difference is that Turtle wow is transformative

"Transformative uses are those that add something new, with a further purpose or different character, and do not substitute for the original use of the work. Nature of the copyrighted work: This factor analyses the degree to which the work that was used relates to copyright's purpose of encouraging creative expression."

[Pfwg]

THE BELOW POST IS NOT LEGAL ADVICE

Firstly, server is hosted in the UK so would use UK IP law and not EU IP law, though they're not too dissimilar. Secondly, Blizzard doesn't generally take down private servers, they just make it so uncomfortable for the hosts that they'd rather not be a private server host any more. I haven't -ever- heard of a Blizz IP case actually making it to court.

Here is what "Blizzard shutting down a pserver" actually is:
- Blizz hear about pserver
- Blizz hire or use a lawyer to send a cease and desist letter to the hosts, or their ISP.
- Blizz waits

What this looks like to a pserver host:
- You recieve a C&D
- You know you're breaking IP law, because 99% of private servers are.
- Turtle cash shop is making money from Blizz's IP so it's an open-and-shut case
- You know you have some defenses (eg "transformative") but these generally don't work

Now the pserver host has a decision to make:
- hire a solicitor, spending thousands of pounds on a case you're going to lose, money which you don't get back when you do lose. You can't fight Blizz's legal team, they're full time employed lawyers. Trying it is overwhelmingly foolish in the arena of IP law.
- take down your server (see Nostalrius)
- relocate the server to Russia or China, where IP law is, well, practically nonexistent



Given the Turtle Team's slavic connections, I'd imagine they're in a position to relocate the server if the C&D did come through. I know a cease and desist letter doesn't sound particularly ominous or serious, but it is very, very serious indeed. Given how recent Retail Classic WoW has been, I don't think "transformativity" or "abandonware" would get past a judge in the UK.

Further reading regarding changes to UK IP law post-brexit (not much has changed tbh): https://www.gov.uk/government/news/inte ... nuary-2021

[Lahire]

Yeah the only way to be sure to survive under Acti-Blizz's nose is to be located in Russia and to not make commercial money from the project (selfless "donations" are ok, but direct buy of goods/services are not).

The second point is already in place : the shop is formally disconnected from the donations (even if there is, factually, the possibility to convert money into token, it's not presented as "buy some tokens").

This said, I know a french vanilla p-serv which has thousands of active characters, a direct cash shop and is located in France : they had zero problem for almost a decade now.

[Pfwg]

ALSO NOT LEGAL ADVICE

The second point is already in place : the shop is formally disconnected from the donations (even if there is, factually, the possibility to convert money into token, it's not presented as "buy some tokens").

True, but probably wouldn't hold up and probably not working sinking a lot of money into. This is the sort of thing that might work in a US court but almost certainly wouldn't in UK court.

This said, I know a french vanilla p-serv which has thousands of active characters, a direct cash shop and is located in France : they had zero problem for almost a decade now.

That's hopeful news, but even they will need to make a decision if the C&D comes through. I don't think the chances of the letters being sent is particularly high, but once it has, the host is in a pickle.