Draenei

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Kanto123
Posts: 160

Draenei

Post by Kanto123 » Mon Jan 03, 2022 6:47 pm

Any plans to make Draenei playable for the alliance? Since they already have been implemented in TBC adding them to this server wouldn't be as difficult as adding goblins since armor already fits them and they have their own starting zone. To balance it out with an addition to the horde, Ogres would be good with Clefthoofs as their mounts, but that would be much more work.

I pay horde myself, but I wouldn't mind if there was a race imbalance where Alliance has 6 races with the addition of Draenei and Horde remains at 5

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Allwynd01
Posts: 207

Re: Draenei

Post by Allwynd01 » Mon Jan 03, 2022 7:30 pm

I hope not. I'm not even sure if those spacehip goats even are canon or not. Even if they are, having spaceships in a grounded high fantasy MMORPG such as Vanilla WoW would be like the first step to turning the game into a joke. Activision is already doing a fine job at that, Turtle WoW doesn't need to copy it.

No offense, but a race from another planet just doesn't really fit in and I don't see the point of that. Better to tweak classes further and adding actual new content to the world.

Nothing personal, I hope you don't take it that way, it was not my intention.

Karrados
Posts: 24

Re: Draenei

Post by Karrados » Mon Jan 03, 2022 7:38 pm

Absolutely not.

From what I gathered the Team wants to get some form of Faction Balance going on and giving the Dominating Faction another Race while leaving the other Faction in the dust would do absolutely nothing.

Right now The Alliance has two of the most popular races along with an extremely popular class (Paladin). They don't need more.

It's already bad enough that they gave Blood Elves to the Alliance in the form of High Elves while Horde got Goblins which were left in a sorry shape until the recent patch.

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Merikkinon
Posts: 413

Re: Draenei

Post by Merikkinon » Mon Jan 03, 2022 8:03 pm

Valid point. The Paladin + Pretty Classes for Alliance has not helped.

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Aszura
Posts: 48
Location: Scarlet Monastery

Re: Draenei

Post by Aszura » Mon Jan 03, 2022 9:12 pm

this is a draenei

Image

are you sure you want this?

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Allwynd01
Posts: 207

Re: Draenei

Post by Allwynd01 » Mon Jan 03, 2022 9:41 pm

Aszura wrote:
Mon Jan 03, 2022 9:12 pm
this is a draenei

Image

are you sure you want this?
Holly Hell, Draenei are uglier than Gnomes, I did not think that was possible.

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Kanto123
Posts: 160

Re: Draenei

Post by Kanto123 » Mon Jan 03, 2022 10:04 pm

Allwynd01 wrote:
Mon Jan 03, 2022 7:30 pm
I hope not. I'm not even sure if those spacehip goats even are canon or not. Even if they are, having spaceships in a grounded high fantasy MMORPG such as Vanilla WoW would be like the first step to turning the game into a joke. Activision is already doing a fine job at that, Turtle WoW doesn't need to copy it.

No offense, but a race from another planet just doesn't really fit in and I don't see the point of that. Better to tweak classes further and adding actual new content to the world.

Nothing personal, I hope you don't take it that way, it was not my intention.
Draenei were in Warcraft 3 via Kil-Jaeden and Archimonde, and Orcs are an alien race themselves. I agree with the other poster that adding a new race to the dominant faction without an accompanying horde addition wouldn't be wise because it would encourage further faction imbalance, but from an aesthetic/artistic perspective I don't have issue with Draenei being added

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Afaslizo
Posts: 75

Re: Draenei

Post by Afaslizo » Mon Jan 03, 2022 11:56 pm

Furbolgs and Ogres are more likely to be playable than Broken and I am fine with that.

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Aszura
Posts: 48
Location: Scarlet Monastery

Re: Draenei

Post by Aszura » Tue Jan 04, 2022 2:12 am

so, Draenei are that ugly thing i posted above, they are arrogant monsters that will never join any faction

Turtle Wow follows Warcraft lore, so, the Draenei are STILL swamp monsters, the space goat yall are talking dont exist here, thats a retcon...

TBC had Draenei cause China didnt let Blizz add Pandaren, thats the actual real reason, they also had to make a big retcon in the lore to make playable Draenei, many people disliked that in that time. Draenai were a mistake.

It would be more viable to add Pandarens or Worgens as new races than either breaking the first rule (warcraft inspired) by making the same retcon as blizz or wasting years to make a fully playable vanilla Draenei (swamp beast)

edit: wasting because they arent paid to make a expansion
edit 2: Pandaren and Worgen are cannon, same as Tuskarr

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Kanto123
Posts: 160

Re: Draenei

Post by Kanto123 » Tue Jan 04, 2022 2:28 am

Aszura wrote:
Tue Jan 04, 2022 2:12 am
so, Draenei are that ugly thing i posted above, they are arrogant monsters that will never join any faction

Turtle Wow follows Warcraft lore, so, the Draenei are STILL swamp monsters, the space goat yall are talking dont exist here, thats a retcon...

TBC had Draenei cause China didnt let Blizz add Pandaren, thats the actual real reason, they also had to make a big retcon in the lore to make playable Draenei, many people disliked that in that time. Draenai were a mistake.

It would be more viable to add Pandarens or Worgens as new races than either breaking the first rule (warcraft inspired) by making the same retcon as blizz or wasting years to make a fully playable vanilla Draenei (swamp beast)

edit: wasting because they arent paid to make a expansion
edit 2: Pandaren and Worgen are cannon, same as Tuskarr
I'm not a big fan of Pandaran and Worgen. I feel Pandaran are a bit too goofy, and Worgen don't fit thematically on either faction- I also think Forsaken aren't a good match for the Horde, but were added there by default because they are an even worse match for the Alliance.

I still think Ogres are the next best addition for the Horde, if the Turtle developers ever wish to add more races which I'm sure would be a pain to implement. As for Alliance, if not draenei, I can't imagine another race that is an obvious choice that fits the faction thematically.

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Kanto123
Posts: 160

Re: Draenei

Post by Kanto123 » Tue Jan 04, 2022 2:31 am

Afaslizo wrote:
Mon Jan 03, 2022 11:56 pm
Furbolgs and Ogres are more likely to be playable than Broken and I am fine with that.
Furbolgs would be fun as a Horde race since they have a tribal nature to them; I'd certainly like to play as one

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Allwynd01
Posts: 207

Re: Draenei

Post by Allwynd01 » Tue Jan 04, 2022 2:41 am

Kanto123 wrote:
Mon Jan 03, 2022 10:04 pm
Allwynd01 wrote:
Mon Jan 03, 2022 7:30 pm
I hope not. I'm not even sure if those spacehip goats even are canon or not. Even if they are, having spaceships in a grounded high fantasy MMORPG such as Vanilla WoW would be like the first step to turning the game into a joke. Activision is already doing a fine job at that, Turtle WoW doesn't need to copy it.

No offense, but a race from another planet just doesn't really fit in and I don't see the point of that. Better to tweak classes further and adding actual new content to the world.

Nothing personal, I hope you don't take it that way, it was not my intention.
Draenei were in Warcraft 3 via Kil-Jaeden and Archimonde, and Orcs are an alien race themselves. I agree with the other poster that adding a new race to the dominant faction without an accompanying horde addition wouldn't be wise because it would encourage further faction imbalance, but from an aesthetic/artistic perspective I don't have issue with Draenei being added
I have never played the Warcraft 3 Campaign, I tried playing the game, but I prefer Age of Empires 2 as a superior RTS, even though I would have preferred it if it was fantasy themed, rather than historical, WC3 seems too simplistic and boring in comparison and doesn't support the most important feature - RMG - Random Map Generation.

I also have never touched WC1 or WC2 so I don't even know if Draenei were ever mentioned there or not.

My point is, yes, Orcs came through the Dark portal, so did these Draenei or corrupted Draenei, but then the portal closed, end of story. Even if they add Draenei and they have a Horde race prepared as well, it means Draenei will still come with their spaceships and sci-fi crap that they have. Vanilla WoW doesn't need such crap. The appeal is that it's simplistic, down-to-earth, generic high fantasy MMORPG. End of story. I don't know how to explain it any simpler than that, but IMO, no such nonsense races should ever be added. The Turtle team should instead continue expanding the game horizontally, by improving classes, adding new quests and expanding the game world with new areas like they are doing, I don't need anything else.

This is just my opinion, I'm not saying that "This is how things should be done and if it doesn't happen, I'm gonna throw a tantrum.", but more that I only envision such path for the success of Turtle WoW and a way to continually expand the player base and grow further.

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Kanto123
Posts: 160

Re: Draenei

Post by Kanto123 » Tue Jan 04, 2022 6:11 am

Allwynd01 wrote:
Tue Jan 04, 2022 2:41 am
Kanto123 wrote:
Mon Jan 03, 2022 10:04 pm
Allwynd01 wrote:
Mon Jan 03, 2022 7:30 pm
I hope not. I'm not even sure if those spacehip goats even are canon or not. Even if they are, having spaceships in a grounded high fantasy MMORPG such as Vanilla WoW would be like the first step to turning the game into a joke. Activision is already doing a fine job at that, Turtle WoW doesn't need to copy it.

No offense, but a race from another planet just doesn't really fit in and I don't see the point of that. Better to tweak classes further and adding actual new content to the world.

Nothing personal, I hope you don't take it that way, it was not my intention.
Draenei were in Warcraft 3 via Kil-Jaeden and Archimonde, and Orcs are an alien race themselves. I agree with the other poster that adding a new race to the dominant faction without an accompanying horde addition wouldn't be wise because it would encourage further faction imbalance, but from an aesthetic/artistic perspective I don't have issue with Draenei being added
I have never played the Warcraft 3 Campaign, I tried playing the game, but I prefer Age of Empires 2 as a superior RTS, even though I would have preferred it if it was fantasy themed, rather than historical, WC3 seems too simplistic and boring in comparison and doesn't support the most important feature - RMG - Random Map Generation.

I also have never touched WC1 or WC2 so I don't even know if Draenei were ever mentioned there or not.

My point is, yes, Orcs came through the Dark portal, so did these Draenei or corrupted Draenei, but then the portal closed, end of story. Even if they add Draenei and they have a Horde race prepared as well, it means Draenei will still come with their spaceships and sci-fi crap that they have. Vanilla WoW doesn't need such crap. The appeal is that it's simplistic, down-to-earth, generic high fantasy MMORPG. End of story. I don't know how to explain it any simpler than that, but IMO, no such nonsense races should ever be added. The Turtle team should instead continue expanding the game horizontally, by improving classes, adding new quests and expanding the game world with new areas like they are doing, I don't need anything else.

This is just my opinion, I'm not saying that "This is how things should be done and if it doesn't happen, I'm gonna throw a tantrum.", but more that I only envision such path for the success of Turtle WoW and a way to continually expand the player base and grow further.
This seems to be a topic you have strong opinions about. The sci-fi elements that the Draenei add aren't traditional sci-fi in the sense that their ships/ architecture isn't something you'd see in Star Trek. I think they have a nice aesthetic and wouldn't describe them as crap myself; I think Blizzard deliberately toned down their sci-fi elements so they wouldn't create a strong clash with what already exists in the game.
I don't have too much of a dog in this fight since I probably wouldn't play Draenei anyway, I personally play on the Horde. However I do understand you're argument as they are a departure from what would be found in a generic high fantasy setting- the draenei wouldn't fit in something like Lord of the Rings.

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Lahire
Posts: 175

Re: Draenei

Post by Lahire » Tue Jan 04, 2022 10:47 am

Aszura wrote:
Mon Jan 03, 2022 9:12 pm
this is a draenei

Image

are you sure you want this?
Exactly.

Spacegoats are not canon and are dumb. Something invented on a table corner during lunchtime because they wanted to give shaman to alliance and couldn't find any other idea. It comes out of nowhere on a spaceship - lol - and is an early example of the bad soap opera writing of retail.

"BTW a spacecraft brings new goats" is as much bad writing as "BTW a nippledude was behind everything all along".
Kanto123 wrote:
Mon Jan 03, 2022 10:04 pm
Draenei were in Warcraft 3 via Kil-Jaeden and Archimonde
That's another dumb retcon. Archimonde is not a "draenei" (!), he is a big demon in WC3.
Draenei are the broken, that's all they are.
Main: Whitemare

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Afaslizo
Posts: 75

Re: Draenei

Post by Afaslizo » Tue Jan 04, 2022 10:52 am

Kanto123 wrote:
Tue Jan 04, 2022 2:31 am
Afaslizo wrote:
Mon Jan 03, 2022 11:56 pm
Furbolgs and Ogres are more likely to be playable than Broken and I am fine with that.
Furbolgs would be fun as a Horde race since they have a tribal nature to them; I'd certainly like to play as one
Furbolgs would be Alliance and Ogres Horde of course. Being based on the RTS Furbolgs are closer to Night Elves than any Horde race.

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Zack32
Posts: 19

Re: Draenei

Post by Zack32 » Tue Jan 04, 2022 11:03 am

Draenei are part of the backbone of the lore since Warcraft 2 manual mentioned them, Draenor was specifically named after them. If we have an Outland expansion, they will play a big role. They could be added as a neutral Race, that's for sure.

But RTS Draenei and TBC Draenei are two different beasts. OG Draenei were native from Draenor (hence the name) and had a Shamanistic culture not unlike the Orcs. They were mostly exterminated by the latter to test the Orcs under the order of Kil'Jaeden. Those who survived started to specialize in guerilla warfare and continued to fight against the Orcs and particularly the Fel Horde when Draenor imploded. In short they were freaking badasses.

Then TBC came and they were retcon as non-corrupt Eredar, they were followers of the Light through some crystal dudes, had not!Spaceships and not!Sci-fi tech and were good at Arcane. Yet they still got slaughtered by the Orcs. Worse, Rise of the Horde detailed how it happened and... for most of the war, the Orcs had lost their shamans and weren't juiced on demon blood, they were just a bunch of Iron Ages tribes attacking settlements who had Paladins as police force. The Draenei still got slaughtered. I cannot fathom how incompetent that make them look like. It doesn't help their lore is based on areas heavily Human/High Elf centric (the Light, Arcane...) rather than something new. Their connection to Eredar is also just there. The Naaru are also pretty lame as far as "angels" go. Then there's the Draenor naming retcon...

Really, OG Draenei are far more superior from a lore pov than the Waifu-bait Space Goats.

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Rudyraccoon
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Re: Draenei

Post by Rudyraccoon » Tue Jan 04, 2022 12:15 pm

As many have already stated, I do agree with them that TBC Draenei really don't belong in a high-fantasy setting such as WoW, due to them being more sci-fi focused. Also, Kil'jaeden and Archimonde in the original lore were demons that are called 'Eredar', no relation to OG Draenei and nothing more.

TBC Draenei being the original uncorrupted Eredar was a retcon, just as an excuse for Blizzard to give Alliance a new playable race out of nowhere instead of logically giving them High Elves. And Blizzard only gave Blood Elves to the Horde because they wanted to give the Horde a pretty race, but even that itself is a retcon, as in the original lore, all of the Blood Elves went to Draenor/Outland with Kael'thas.

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Zack32
Posts: 19

Re: Draenei

Post by Zack32 » Tue Jan 04, 2022 2:31 pm

Aszura wrote:
Mon Jan 03, 2022 9:12 pm
this is a draenei

Image

are you sure you want this?
In fairness, even the old lore had mentions of Draenei's physical appearances being mutated by the corruption of Draenor. The Last Guardian had Khadgar and Medivh speculating that Garona other half came from a near-Human species native of Draenor (since the og First War timeline was greatly reduced). Later, a vision of Gul'dan in his tower showing a human-like skull seems to have confirmed their thoughts. The original plan was apparently to have these "near-humans" to be non-mutated Draenei but then TBC happened.

https://wowpedia.fandom.com/wiki/Near-human

Sartosanfemboi
Posts: 3

Re: Draenei

Post by Sartosanfemboi » Tue Jan 04, 2022 5:44 pm

Aszura wrote:
Mon Jan 03, 2022 9:12 pm
this is a draenei

Image

are you sure you want this?
Yes. Idk if it SHOULD be added to the alliance. But I 100% want this in the game. If not as a playable race, then at least a neutral faction. I know there are couple in blasted lands and the swamp north of it, but they are hostile to everyone.

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Zack32
Posts: 19

Re: Draenei

Post by Zack32 » Tue Jan 04, 2022 6:30 pm

Sartosanfemboi wrote:
Tue Jan 04, 2022 5:44 pm
Aszura wrote:
Mon Jan 03, 2022 9:12 pm
this is a draenei

Image

are you sure you want this?
Yes. Idk if it SHOULD be added to the alliance. But I 100% want this in the game. If not as a playable race, then at least a neutral faction. I know there are couple in blasted lands and the swamp north of it, but they are hostile to everyone.
Actually, a few of them are non-hostile and give quests to deal with the hostile ones in the Swamp.

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